I agree with Ignatius. He's closer than the OP guy, but close only counts with hand grenades and horse-shoe tossing.
I believe that's Tom Bisio, who is a North American Tang Shou Tao member. I don't know Tom, but I know a few TST people and some of them have had access to some neigong stuff, but in terms of jin and body mechanics, I haven't seen it. The NATST has its roots in guys who studied on Taiwan. As two very good Chinese friends of my from Taiwan put it, there was an uproar back in the 60's about some of the martial experts like Hong Yi Xiang teaching foreigners. Some of these, including Hong, stood before the martial-arts council and swore that they were only showing the foreigners the external aspects of the arts.
From my experience that's all most of them know and hence this video. Be happy to debate it with one of them, but I'm on pretty firm ground.
Regardless of whom Bisio studied with, his movement speaks for itself. By bringing in Gao Jiwu and others, you're suggesting, essentially, that they are also responsible for his movement. That speaks poorly of either those teachers or Tom Bisio's ability to understand correct 6H movement.
...one factor I've noticed for years is that if someone starts out in Chinese martial-arts and thinks that they understand things, they might go to a better teacher later, but they don't really learn because, as they say, "their cup is already full". Usually if someone learns BS CMA's it's very hard for them to drop the preconceptions they first learned. That's why there's so much emphasis on your own ability to understand. You have to be smart to really understand the complexity of Chinese martial-arts.
Bob wrote:Mianbao:
I cannot say enough good things about Tom Bisio's materials - some years back I bought Tim Cartmell's book on the Xing Yi Nei gong exercises and was amazed at how close they were to the baji nei gong I learned.
Also ran into an individual who taught me about half the exercises - that was in the late 1980s or early 1990s and forgot about the exercises. In my late fifties I got interested in them but couldn't remember much.
When Bisio came out with the xing yi nei gong I bought the on-line version and it has been worth every penny.
His explanations, through the lens of traditional Chinese correlational cosmology and traditional Chinese medicine, are superb.
The instruction is A+ and I have had experience in making programs with baji, bagua, and taiji. He has done it well - good balance between the intellectual and the practicality.
I sincerely think you cannot go wrong with xing yi nei gong training program and I hope he does more with xing yi in the future.
wayne hansen wrote:As TST practicioner I must say the internal was taught to westerners especially by hsu hong chi
The stuff from both Bisio and cartmell is not TST noi gung
They are good basic exercises and with instruction may go deeply but as shown on the tapes and books are not very profound
wayne hansen wrote:What are you referring to when you say
It's not them but rather the way they were taught
Re: Steve Cotter Hsing-I
Postby kenneth fish on Mon May 27, 2013 8:54 am
Just an aside: The way he is showing his Xingyi is pretty much the way he was taught. Xu Hongji made significant adjustments to the mechanics of the Yizong Xingyi, and that is how Xu's students teach it. The leap from dragon posture to dragon posture is very common in Hebei and Shandong Xingyi. - it is one of several variations of the dragon and has specific training benefits. AFAIK Hong Yixiang (and Hong's students, including Xu) only learned/trained this aspect of dragon.
Re: Steve Cotter Hsing-I
Postby wayne hansen on Mon May 27, 2013 5:54 pm
kenneth fish wrote:
Just an aside: The way he is showing his Xingyi is pretty much the way he was taught. Xu Hongji made significant adjustments to the mechanics of the Yizong Xingyi, and that is how Xu's students teach it. The leap from dragon posture to dragon posture is very common in Hebei and Shandong Xingyi. - it is one of several variations of the dragon and has specific training benefits. AFAIK Hong Yixiang (and Hong's students, including Xu) only learned/trained this aspect of dragon.
I don't know how often Steve trains his hsing I
He is certainly fit and can go much higher in dragon than I ever did.
However I think is trying to show his physical dexterity to a gym crowd rather than the function of the form
Re: Steve Cotter Hsing-I
Postby kenneth fish on Mon May 27, 2013 8:41 pm
That was not the point of my post - I was pointing out that he was simply demonstrating it as he had learned it, and if some felt it was deficient it was a reflection of how the set was taught.
Re: Steve Cotter Hsing-I
Postby wayne hansen on Tue May 28, 2013 7:36 pm
i dont know who he trained with after mike patterson but i have seen mike do it and that is not the way mike does it
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