Bao wrote:Oh, I thought it was a vid on how UA defended their actions.
I don't think they will do anything similar again as it was completely illegal. There is absolutely nothing that supports their action. But I think I'll study that vid properly if I am going to travel anywhere within the US. Just in case....
windwalker wrote:Bao wrote:Oh, I thought it was a vid on how UA defended their actions.
I don't think they will do anything similar again as it was completely illegal. There is absolutely nothing that supports their action. But I think I'll study that vid properly if I am going to travel anywhere within the US. Just in case....
can you explain the illegality of it and what does not support the actions.
yes all should make themselves aware of the "law" by reading the contract they agree to by buying the ticket.
Lawyer here. This myth that passengers don't have rights needs to go away, ASAP. You are dead wrong when saying that United legally kicked him off the plane.
1. First of all, it's airline spin to call this an overbooking. The statutory provision granting them the ability to deny boarding is about "OVERSELLING", which is specifically defined as booking more reserved confirmed seats than there are available. This is not what happened. They did not overbook the flight; they had a fully booked flight, and not only did everyone already have a reserved confirmed seat, they were all sitting in them. The law allowing them to deny boarding in the event of an oversale does not apply.
2. Even if it did apply, the law is unambiguously clear that airlines have to give preference to everyone with reserved confirmed seats when choosing to involuntarily deny boarding. They have to always choose the solution that will affect the least amount of reserved confirmed seats. This rule is straightforward, and United makes very clear in their own contract of carriage that employees of their own or of other carriers may be denied boarding without compensation because they do not have reserved confirmed seats. On its face, it's clear that what they did was illegal-- they gave preference to their employees over people who had reserved confirmed seats, in violation of 14 CFR 250.2a.
3. Furthermore, even if you try and twist this into a legal application of 250.2a and say that United had the right to deny him boarding in the event of an overbooking; they did NOT have the right to kick him off the plane. Their contract of carriage highlights there is a complete difference in rights after you've boarded and sat on the plane, and Rule 21 goes over the specific scenarios where you could get kicked off. NONE of them apply here. He did absolutely nothing wrong and shouldn't have been targeted. He's going to leave with a hefty settlement after this fiasco.
Federal regulations do not prevent carriers from selling more seats than a flight can accommodate, a practice the airline industry says allows carriers to try to fill planes despite the number of no-shows that they can expect on any given flight.
Typically, airlines will ask for volunteers on oversold flights, promising some sort of compensation in return for taking a different flight. If few volunteer, carriers typically will keep increasing their offers until enough fliers agree to take another flight.
If not enough volunteers are found, the airline has the power to decide who gets “bumped” off the flight, though that typically happens before boarding.
United warns of the potential to deny boarding for an oversold flight even if a passenger doesn't want to leave. The Sunday flight that caused outrage worldwide wasn't oversold. However, it was sold out and United said it needed four seats for crew members to reach their next flights.
So why can't a passenger simply refuse to leave, as the man in the video did? (He reportedly told the crew he was a doctor and he too needed to be at his destination the following morning for work.)
Well, at that point the airline had another legal weapon: Any action or behavior that is judged to be "interfering with the flight crew" is against the law. "Interfering" is vague and can cover a broad range of passenger behavior, and can encompass almost anything that makes the flight crew feel uncomfortable.
Bao wrote:What right did they have according to what he signed? .
"If you're still in the terminal waiting to board, you can be told you can't board, even if you have a reservation, even if you have a ticket. And once you're on board, you are subject to being deplaned based on the order of the crew. So you don't really have any rights,"
Bao wrote:Oh, I thought it was a vid on how UA defended their actions.
I don't think they will do anything similar again as it was completely illegal. There is absolutely nothing that supports their action. But I think I'll study that vid properly if I am going to travel anywhere within the US. Just in case....
At first, the airline asked for volunteers and offering $400 per seat. When that didn’t work, they offered $800 per passenger. When no one voluntarily came forward, United selected four passengers at random.
“If there are no takers, you should be aware that it’s lottery time and your number can come up,” said Weinstein.
Three deplaned but the fourth, a man who said he was a doctor and needed to get home to treat patients on Monday, refused.
Three men, identified later as city aviation department security officers, got on the plane. Two officers tried to reason with the man before a third came aboard and pointed at the man “basically saying, ‘Sir, you have to get off the plane,'” said Tyler Bridges, a passenger whose wife, Audra D. Bridges, posted a video on Facebook.
One of the security officers grabbed the screaming man from his window seat, across the armrest and dragging him down the aisle by his arms.
United Airlines’ parent company CEO Oscar Munoz late Monday issued a letter defending his employees, saying the passenger was being “disruptive and belligerent.”
Weinstein said the airport police were well within their right to remove the passenger. The question now centers on how it was done and the amount of force used. Passengers say there was an easier way to get the same results with out all the attention.
GrahamB wrote:So, it's legal to be assaulted if you're on a plane in the US by security staff.
GO USA! FREEEEEEEEEEEEEEEDOMMMMMM!
Ian C. Kuzushi"
It is illegal to remove people from the plane like that once they have boarded.
there is no hope for freedom and liberty unless we start to fight for it. Not surprising that Airport cops would act like this.
They are the bottom of an already rotten barrel of apples
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