Best internal guys alive today?

[jonathan.bluestein]

I'm currently visiting Chen Zhonghua's school in China. From what I've personally seen and felt during the last few days, I feel that he definitely ought to be on the list. Let me tell you - his best stuff you don't get to see online... At least not on the free videos on Youtube. He has a very high level of skill, and he had shown it to be pretty combat-effective, too.

Hi Jonathan,

I'm always interested in reading your thoughts on training. I'm curious what you'd think if you had a chance to train with Alex Skalozub at one of his seminars in Haifa, Israel. He's one of the very top ILC Kung Fu guys, and I've been told he has very high-level skills. I've trained with one of his students, Daria Sergeeva, and thought she was very, very good.

This was his last seminar in Israel:
Haifa, Israel, workshop with Alex Skalozub
Fri, 04/19/2013 (All day) - Sat, 04/20/2013 (All day)
Topic: "Circle with cross. 4 quarters. How to release the energy. Spinning Hand. Concave and Convex."

Contact: Alexander Gilelakh
Email: [email protected]
Contact phone: 0504341437

Thanks for the info. I was invited to the event by his student, Dimitri (https://www.facebook.com/dmitry.deitch). Unfortunately, it kinda clashed with my university studies. I hope to be able to check them out in the future. It seems to me that ILC is very close in its mechanics to XYQ and Yi Quan, and it'd be a pleasure to learn more about this art.

[Bugang]

Outside of Ryabko and Vasiliev... Yap Cheng Hai and Vincent Chu both had interesting stuff. I've seen plenty of other people, most of them had something to offer in greater or lesser degress, but not to the extent of seeking them out specifically

Has anyone here trained with Vincent Chu or Gin Soon in Boston? I heard these Yang guys are very good. I was even warned that if you haven't yet learned to sink into their root through softness, it will be a tough experience.

Trained with H Won Gim, Disciple of G S Chu. He ist VERY good as far as I am able to judge anyone of that level. And seems Vincent is even better. But no tough experience except if you want to go into a fight - Gim is very friendly and relally likes to teach to become his Students better and better. Which is not common in (I)MA Circles... - Oh, but, yes, the training methods can be tough, 1 hour of Standing (and pushing all the while! [albeit softly]) is not for everyone. But showing great results.

[san5324]

I would base my opinion on the fact if any teacher can on any giving moment show you his/her qi flow by producing goosebumps over their whole body when they want to. If you meet somebody who can pull that off, add him to the list.

[GrahamB]

Kron Gracie

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arWU61UC2PI

[cloudz]

Kron Gracie

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=arWU61UC2PI

Someone posted that on another forum (bjj section)... This was one of the replies.
I thought it was very funny myself..

Yep, he looked pretty good getting reversed repeatedly from back control against a 39-year-old bantamweight who hasn't won a relevant fight since 2011.

Extrapolating his current activity rate and the quality increase of opposition, he should be ready for a top-50 opponent shortly before the sun swells into a red giant and consumes the inner planets.

[Niall Keane]

There's a lot of boxercise boys posting recommendations about performance art coaches on this thread, I'm sure like every good dance coach they can move their bodies and teach you to move your's in unusual ways... but there does exist a litmus test when it comes to fighting and well that's.... fighting. It's kind of a prequal really.
It does restore some confidence to see that a sizeable minority did post about experienced fighters who became experienced coaches of fighters, masters of their art. A lot of ye guys seem to be of the USA, and while I do recognize there can be plenty of hidden dragons (i'm about to mention one) it's a bit incredible the general lack of mention in the vast majority of posts of your William Chen, Mike Patterson and Tim Cartmell? All internationally known as fighters and producers of same, I guess they don't shake out enough fajings in their forms. ( the "g" is deliberate! )

As for "da stretz" and bare-knuckle fistycuffs... well coming from a culture where bare-knuckle boxing is prevalent, I suffer no delusion as to how the skill of such street scrappers pales before professional fighters. If it didn't they'd seek out the purse themselves!

On this side of the Atlantic, for me a lad who meets the prequal and is the best I've seen with amazing subtlety under pressure and with the ability to train others such skill is Stephen Wooster. http://www.taichiessex.org/
Back in the eighties after watching him compete, his Sigung Cheng Tin-hung (an unparalleled successful coach of fighters back in the 60's, 70's when 99% of CIMA was asleep) told his own student, Steve's Sifu - Dan Docherty to "make him your right-hand man" . That alone should speak volumes to the aware.
You won't find anything on youtube, he doesn't promote himself really, in his own words he'd "rather people go to his Sifu", but he does post on FB a bit, mainly to assist his own students and gungfu brothers. But the serious should check him out.

[Niall Keane]

There's lots of others too an IMA fighter should discover:

Neil Rossiak (London) and his students including the one time millde-weight MMA champ of the UK and defeater of UFC veterans Sami Berrik.
Dave Baker in Oxford... another excellent coach of champions.
Ray White in London too, not sure if he still coaches?

All these guys have done the business, all students of Dan Docherty who is still around himself with golden nuggets of instruction.

But they won't teach you dance-off moves...

[amor]

Trained with H Won Gim, Disciple of G S Chu. He ist VERY good as far as I am able to judge anyone of that level. And seems Vincent is even better. But no tough experience except if you want to go into a fight - Gim is very friendly and relally likes to teach to become his Students better and better. Which is not common in (I)MA Circles... - Oh, but, yes, the training methods can be tough, 1 hour of Standing (and pushing all the while! [albeit softly]) is not for everyone. But showing great results.

There is someone on the forum (not gonna name names) who doesn't think much of Vincent Chu ...from his form anyway but you can't really tell ones level of internal power from their form alone, or maybe you can.

But I remember H Won Gim from previous threads, he looks like a good fighter doing all that 'raising the shen' push hands shown on videos at his site. I recall his take on the 4oz vs 1000lbs about 1oz being incredibly powerful IP - like a baby fighting an adult - Is this how you understand it or do you believe the more mainstream view?

[willie]

There's a lot of boxercise boys. I guess they don't shake out enough fajings in their forms. ( the "g" is deliberate! )

.

Why so negative?
I take it that you don't like fajin?
Fajin is the result of correct training, it happens naturally. like sitting on an egg, sitting...

[Niall Keane]

There's a lot of boxercise boys. I guess they don't shake out enough fajings in their forms. ( the "g" is deliberate! )

.

Why so negative?
I take it that you don't like fajin?
Fajin is the result of correct training, it happens naturally. like sitting on an egg, sitting...

Ive had world renowned masters and heads of lineages (and not my own) compliment me on my "fajin" in spear play ... so I guess I can dance too, I'm well aware of what it is and how to execute it along the body to any point or several or everywhere at once, and I can and have used it on resistant opponents who wanted nothing better than to knock me unconscious ... my point is that it is a basic skill, and plays the part of finesse in otherwise staple martial arts techniques, much like Dim Mak.

Surely you have to admit that so many here focus on polishing the blade before they have extracted the ore!

[MaartenSFS]

Apparently "best" internal has nothing to do with fighting... I made a joke the other day; "Internal means that when I hit him there is internal damage." Most people in China are just as clueless as anywhere else..

[D_Glenn]

Here's a quick summary of all the names listed on this thread and a few key comments.
And in the order they were first named.
Some are not actually alive now RIP, so they would not qualify as "best internal guys alive today" -

mikhail ryabko
sam chin
serge augier
akuzawa minoru
vladamir vasiliev
yap cheng hai
vincent chu
su dong chen
paul whitrod
luo de xiu
william cc chen
peter ralston
chen yu
ma jiang bao
yun yin sen (lhbf)
("how do you rationalize the systema guys are internal?")
xu ai zhai
gin soon
ken fish
xie bingcan
yo momma
ma chuanxu
qian zhaohong
yang hai
lin fuzhu
shan changwen
("gin soon [chu]! are you serious?")
ck chu
mike patterson
master li
liu rui (zhaobao taiji)
li zhanhua (tongbeiquan)
he jinbao
chin lik keong and jimmy heow
yang guo tai
yuan shao liang (in hongkong "He's the one that LSY [liang shou yu] has 'borrowed' the history from and changed his own history in one of his books.")
tim cartmell
dan docherty
li yen hoa student of chiu chuk kai
george xu
william de thours
marcus brinkman
lin guozheng
bill tucker
george wood
zhang yun
strider clark
henry wang
chu anchung
wai lun choi
li tailiang
yang fansheng
yao pei jing
albert (zheng) liu
malak rida
doc stier
fong ha
guo shilei
zhou jingxuan
zhang suisheng
denis sue-tin
dan harden
sam masich
("best IMA-ist AND neuroscientist - chris mckinley")
chen zhonghua
lu sheng li
h won gim
(then the few non-"boxercise and performance art coaches"--)
stephan wooster
neil rossiak
dave baker
ray white

.

[Rhen]

The only guys who not only talked about fighting and BUT actually entered the ring in this day and age of fight events (since a majority have been around since early 1900's), these are the real best internal guys: if you've stepped and fought on a Lei Tai, A boxing ring, a Cage, and jujitsu mat, a Judo mat, shuai chiao mat and tested your self in some kind of fight event. these are the TRUE best internal guys. You can list names of good folks from lineages, but if they have never competed, then they don't know what real opposition is like.

[windwalker]

Apparently "best" internal has nothing to do with fighting... I made a joke the other day; "Internal means that when I hit him there is internal damage." Most people in China are just as clueless as anywhere else..

Quite correct "best" internal does not necessarily mean best fighter.
If that was the case the post would have been titled best fighter not internal.

Being the best fighter does not automatically
convey usage or understanding of "internal power"

[windwalker]

The only guys who not only talked about fighting and BUT actually entered the ring in this day and age of fight events (since a majority have been around since early 1900's), these are the real best internal guys: if you've stepped and fought on a Lei Tai, A boxing ring, a Cage, and jujitsu mat, a Judo mat, shuai chiao mat and tested your self in some kind of fight event. these are the TRUE best internal guys. You can list names of good folks from lineages, but if they have never competed, then they don't know what real opposition is like.

What makes stepping into a ring a test of "true best internal guys"
Can anyone cite something that is specifically internal that ring fighters can not do