Hand or foot first?

[Josealb]

Every good cross should have a half step. Rocky Marciano and Dempsey are good examples.

[mixjourneyman]

The thing about doing a cross is that you don't always need a half step, since you would usually step on the jab. The other thing is you have to make different considerations for mma, since if you get in too close you risk being taken down.

[schmuhl]

Foot -> body -> step, right? While the subtle practitioner leads all strikes with the foot (rooting regardless of whether or not he is stepping), that doesn't mean that the strike is telegraphed by the body.

I'd worry that allowing the hand to lead the foot (in baguazhang anyway) would compromise alignment and rooting, especially with all the fancy-pants circling.

[mixjourneyman]

Foot -> body -> step, right? While the subtle practitioner leads all strikes with the foot (rooting regardless of whether or not he is stepping), that doesn't mean that the strike is telegraphed by the body.

I'd worry that allowing the hand to lead the foot (in baguazhang anyway) would compromise alignment and rooting, especially with all the fancy-pants circling.

Agreed. In bagua the foot has to step before most movements.

[Dmitri]

I don't think you will find the idea of jab anywhere in IMA for that very reason.

Umm... Perhaps we mean different things by "jab"? I'm using the term "jab" to simply indicate the fact that "front hand" punches (vs. the rear one/"cross")
All 3 main CIMAs have a motherload of those, in all sorts of variations and flavors.

[neijia_boxer]

i use my will (yi) first

[jpaton]

Every good cross should have a half step. Rocky Marciano and Dempsey are good examples.

what are you basing this on? i haven't heard any modern practitioner advocate the need to take a half step on the cross. you measure with the jab and when your distance is correct throw the cross or hook...

watch the video i refered to. freddie roach is a very respected boxing coach:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freddie_Roach_(boxing)

dempsey didn't even throw a proper cross he held his hands way to low to throw what most people would refer to as a cross. not that he wasn't a great fighter just that what he did wouldn't work in modern boxing.

[mixjourneyman]

I don't think you will find the idea of jab anywhere in IMA for that very reason.

Umm... Perhaps we mean different things by "jab"? I'm using the term "jab" to simply indicate the fact that "front hand" punches (vs. the rear one/"cross")
All 3 main CIMAs have a motherload of those, in all sorts of variations and flavors.

Yep, we have a different definition of jab.
No problem.

[mixjourneyman]

Remember, you can throw a hook or an uppercut with the front hand too

[Dmitri]

...or paint your nails on it.

[mixjourneyman]

...or paint your nails on it.

I had a funny experience the other day.
My friends (two college guys, a school teacher, and his girlfriend who is newly immigrated from Japan) and I were eating lunch.
I asked my friend's girlfriend what she does for a living. She said she is going to school to become a nail technician. I said "Oh great! You can do my nails!!". Then one of the guys who was with us (foaf college guy) looked at my one friend and said "I'm going to pretend that didn't happen". Lol, it was hilarious!!!!!

[Ian]

Hands and feet should move at the same time.

My question is, why on earth would they not? I mean, I'm super new, and I was never taught foot or "fist" first, it's just a full movement done at once.

Why would you move one thing before the other?

I'm not saying any way is the right and only way, I'm just honestly curious as a newbie

In my opinion, hands and feet probably should move at the same time simply because you need to move a lot and change directions frequently and rapidly in a chaotic situation. Stop moving = fail.

HOWEVER hands and feet do not always have to arrive at the same time, which is what I think you're getting at (correct me if I'm wrong).

What if you want to hit three or more people in a short period of time? Are you going to take one step for each punch? Or take one step for three punches?

[dragontigerpalm]

Remember, you can throw a hook or an uppercut with the front hand too

I don't think that I've ever seen an uppercut thrown with the front hand. The uppercut I'm referring to involves sinking and full body upward spiraling and as such would be almost impossible - certainly less effective if possible - with the front hand remaining in front.

[Ian]

BTW that particular thing has always been "amusing" (for the lack of better word -- no disrespect implied) to me, i.e. that cross is considered (by non-IMA types) more powerful than jab. There should be no difference whatsoever between how powerful those two are, if one practices IMA.
Just MHO; others' mileage will vary as always.

Dmitri - too powerful for MMA.

Kidding!

[LJN]

Hands and feet very close together.

Lonnie