Your Favourite Taiji Throws?

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Your Favourite Taiji Throws?

Postby cloudz on Mon Jul 17, 2017 5:05 am

johnwang wrote:
everything wrote:But when one tries to smooth out the form, it doesn't seem to be there in the form.

My wife always asks me, "Are you thinking about me every single second? I always say yes. She then said, "I have called your name 3 times. Your eyes are still on your computer screen."

"Intend" is the key. People have said that a

- step can be a kick.
- lotus kick can be a sweep.
- 7 star stance can be a shin bite.
- cloud hand can be a body control.
- ...

If your "intend" is not there, you can't map your body move into that particular application.

In that clip, he used 切(Qie) - Front cut as counter. When his opponent puts leg behind his leg, he steps back his leg and take his opponent down. If he has to use this move for offense, he has to

- put his left foot in front of his opponent right foot.
- move his right leg in a half right curve and land behind his opponent's right foot (otherwise his right leg will hit on the front of his opponent's right leg). This 1/2 arc move is the key for 切(Qie) - Front cut
- ...

Both are missing in the Taiji "step back repulse monkey" move. There are just too many missing element there.



It's not repulse monkey, it's repulse monkey twist step. It's partly why the video and the performer suck a bit. Everything you need is in there (repulse monkey TWIST STEP) to execute the technique. Getting yourself in the right position can vary depending on various factors and this is the same for all moves you can derive from form movements, so it seems pretty stupid to talk about it like it actually fucking matters. So what if you need to step in first, is that not allowed, Is a forward step not in taiji ?

And FYI hip throw is from/in crane spreads wings (I learnt this application from Wu style). Some forms like YCF don't have the body folding forward anymore, but there are examples of torso folding forward in TCC out there in various forms and postures... Even in Wu style white crane, it can be quite subtle at times - depends on the performer and intention I guess. For Yang: If you analyse the arm positions/movements in that posture and how you turn around to face the other way from the preceding Kao; just add a little folding at the waist and it's pretty much all there just as you would use it. Which isn't to say you can't derive other techniques from that posture/ movement.
Last edited by cloudz on Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:08 am, edited 10 times in total.
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Re: Your Favourite Taiji Throws?

Postby cloudz on Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:24 am

johnwang wrote:Which taiji move do you drop your head to touch your knee? I don't think there is such move in all Taiji forms.




One obvious move even in Yang forms from which yours derive there is a move called needle at sea bottom.
maybe you have heard of it?

The body fold forward and the head moves towards the knees. It doesn't touch, but then neither does the old man in your clip.


But "brush knee" has no intention to "touch head to the knees".


This is correct. But I have good reason to think that white crane spreads its wings once did. Or does in some versions/ styles.
There is evidence in the Wu style forms which where taught before YCF modifications.
Wu style was also modified to some degree but has mostly kept this way of doing 'spread wings'.

Sun style has a hip throw from its repulse monkey - a variation of hip throw is taught by Tim Cartmell from that movement. It has more of a around the hip/back feel to it than over the hip/back, making it a more spiral type of throw.

Many years ago, I told my

- MT friend that CMA has "flying knee" if you do a jump kick without kicking your leg out.
- TKD friend that CMA has "spin hook kick" if instead of doing backward floor sweep, you stand up and do that sweep.

Back then I just argued for the sake of argument. That was "CMA has everything" kind of attitude.

This is a fair point. Strictly speaking, there are certainly many techniques in the world and tcc certainly is nowhere near to having them all.
I think a good case for hip throw can be made, whether others share that opinion or not doesn't really change the "evidence" or the fact that it's practiced within some tcc styles and lines ...
Last edited by cloudz on Tue Jul 18, 2017 8:36 am, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Your Favourite Taiji Throws?

Postby cloudz on Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:20 am

Let me add this also.

This prevailing ideology that all your moves have to be in your primary training form is a nonsense anyway. For a few reasons. It's not hard to see that a dilution of knowledge and practices would lead to that kind of situation and thinking though.
Last edited by cloudz on Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
George

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cloudz
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Posts: 2757
Joined: Fri Jun 06, 2008 3:00 am
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