Make your push into a throw

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby Trick on Sun Apr 15, 2018 11:47 pm

willie wrote:
Trick wrote:
Bao wrote:Why not just trap and punch? Then you don’t need to throw. :P

Too easy 8-)

How about a video? J W has provided videos from time to time.

I'm camera shy and non photogenic so I hide behind my shades 8-)
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby Trick on Mon Apr 16, 2018 12:06 am

everything wrote:one more nice one from rugby

Image

looks like maybe a toe is blocked, but at that point it didn't matter

he is a lot bigger, but arguably it looks like he uses a nice peng/lu, then an an.

Those rugby gif's are quite nice examples of how it should work, somehow much better examples that the pure Martialarts demos since the attack can come from any direction the players must have a more all round awareness
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby johnwang on Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:02 am

Trick wrote:Those rugby gif's are quite nice examples of how it should work, ...

That rugby clip remind me some Aikido clips, there are too much force that you can borrow from your opponent. In reality, your opponent won't let you to borrow his force that easy.
I'm still allergy to "push".
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby Steve James on Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:45 pm

In reality, your opponent won't let you to borrow his force that easy.


Unless he thinks he can run over you. ;)
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby everything on Mon Apr 16, 2018 6:03 pm

depends on "reality". weight classes for highly skilled, technical MAists? I'd (theoretically) prefer every point of leverage.

other situations, maybe the rugby examples show something else can still be "practical". the first two GIFs don't show quite as committed an "attack" that as easy for "borrowing". the second GIF is maybe a bad example because the pusher is larger. the first GIF doesn't show whatever attack happened before this lady just punches the other lady down (more xingyiquan than taijiquan I guess ;D ).
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby Trick on Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:39 pm

johnwang wrote:
Trick wrote:Those rugby gif's are quite nice examples of how it should work, ...

That rugby clip remind me some Aikido clips, there are too much force that you can borrow from your opponent. In reality, your opponent won't let you to borrow his force that easy.

Actually I too got to think about Aikido......Of course Rugby is just a game but it's a full-contact game as I understand and the hit can come from anywhere around the player
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby Trick on Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:45 pm

Trick wrote:
johnwang wrote:
Trick wrote:Those rugby gif's are quite nice examples of how it should work, ...

That rugby clip remind me some Aikido clips, there are too much force that you can borrow from your opponent. In reality, your opponent won't let you to borrow his force that easy.

Actually I too got to think about Aikido......Of course Rugby is just a game but it's a full-contact game as I understand and the hit can come from anywhere around the player

That third clip reminded a little of Aikido randori(free practice)
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby wayne hansen on Mon Apr 16, 2018 11:03 pm

That clip is rugby league not rugby
Rugby league players are superbly conditioned and highly trained in bjj and wrestling
Many have gone straight from a playing career into boxing
Anthony Mundine becoming a multiple world champ,admittedly he came from a boxing family
If you want to see some aikido skill look here

https://youtu.be/GVQJ7Uk1FHI
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby wiesiek on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:40 am

" How to make your push into the throw?"

PUSH>>>>>
1. wait for the answer
a/ if he go follow you can use big outer sweep /o sotogari/ or chose between inner sweeps - couchi or ouchi gari
b/ if he is pushing you back , : simply go follow and block his way, by simply sweep /sasae/, or turn and lower your body /lot of "big throws" is possible.
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby wiesiek on Tue Apr 17, 2018 2:50 am

in the rugby clip
we have example "changing direction of the incoming force", not the transfer of the "push"
anyway,
he use too much force, in such case just smooth turn /easy to type :)/would send players on the ground.

ps
John, he is in the air, so his power is send and he can`t change the direction or withdraw
Last edited by wiesiek on Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby wiesiek on Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:05 am

everything wrote:almost looked like he used a leg, but he didn't

Image


here attack was to high
almost free lunch ;)
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby wiesiek on Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:09 am

ps
i just look at JW clips - it illustrated my post / couchi - ouchi in combination/ :)
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby wayne hansen on Tue Apr 17, 2018 3:31 am

wiesiek wrote:
everything wrote:almost looked like he used a leg, but he didn't

Image


here attack was to high
almost free lunch ;)




That's called the Maori side step
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby marvin8 on Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:54 am

wiesiek wrote:in the rugby clip
we have example "changing direction of the incoming force", not the transfer of the "push"
anyway,
he use too much force, in such case just smooth turn /easy to type :)/would send players on the ground.

ps
John, he is in the air, so his power is send and he can`t change the direction or withdraw

Defender creates angle, makes contact, deceptively yields stiff arm while lowering level, pushes attacker (at dead angle) up, backwards and down (an), sending opponent to the ground. It is called ti fang: ;)

Image

@ 3:05:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fSYPOhSgiis&t=3m5s
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Re: Make your push into a throw

Postby everything on Tue Apr 17, 2018 7:56 am

I like marvin's interpretation.

Sorry, I don't know the difference between rugby and rubgy league.

If you look up QB escapes (NFL), there are even better turns to "borrow force" in a smoother way; granted these "attacks" are super committed with tons of force to borrow.
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