Determining Your Focus

[Peacedog]

Maarten,

I don't normally make these suggestions to people as they tend to lack the skills needed to really exploit a visual medium like Instagram, etc. In the case of most people they would need to spend thousands of dollars to hire someone to do the photography, website buildout, etc. They do better with word of mouth advertising. Others have really good writing skills, see Damo Mitchell, so they do well with books and blogs.

As you already have these skills, you might as well take advantage of it.

It also helps that you look the part. Damo Mitchel is a good case in point. He comes across as a fit and vibrant young guy. I have scars on my face and head that most people don't consciously pick up on, but sure as hell do subconsciously. So visual mediums don't really work for me.

Life isn't fair. Appearances matter when utilizing visual mediums and alot of people just don't look good on camera. Big guys in particular come off as goonish, particularly in the martial arts, and this hurts business by scaring off potential clients/students. Women, if they aren't cute, come across as undesirable or angry. Fat guys do not look the part that alternative health people are expecting and come across a having poor self discipline. Guys with glasses look more scholarly and less powerful/martially serious, etc.

Take a good look at Scott Rodell's stuff as he is the pre-eminent CMA sword guy in the US. Also look at BK Frantzis' and Damo Mitchell's websites. They both do very well and it might give you some ideas.

Like I said, you have a story tell if you want to tell it and the authenticity of your photos shows it (i.e. eating bitter), in a world of fakes you might as well benefit from it.

[Peacedog]

For example, this is SGM Vining. He is a legendary retired Delta Operator. He looks like a Sunday school teacher.

He has that look that says, "I'm going to shoot you in the face and I'll enjoy it. And there's nothing you can do about it."



Now this is Shrek. Another retired Delta operator.

https://sobtactical.com/about/

Who looks more dangerous?

Which one would you want to learn CQB from and which one would you prefer to have a lecture on force protection in the developing world from?

[marvin8]

Okay, I think maybe you misunderstood me or I wasn't clear.. In the OP I was talking about determining the focus for your system and I mentioned sparring and wrestling and then my personal situation with fencing. I was not implying that my swordsmanship system is the best way to learn unarmed fighting. I was merely stating that the focus of my swordsmanship system is to get my students to become proficient at fencing and that the entire curriculum is centred around it. That being said, the mechanics for Shuaibeishou are identical in my swordsmanship and unarmed fighting and the mechanics of Zhenjin are the same whether punching or thrusting, so there is great overlap and learning any type of good swordsmanship will greatly enhance your unarmed fighting, I promise you. This is something that really surprised me during my own training. It's not just switching stances. It's not that simple. In the OP I also mentioned my unarmed system and its focus on hand techniques. I'm not sure where the confusion stems from, but I hope that I've cleared it up now.

The mechanics I was referring to are holding the sword with two hands, swinging it (e.g., over your head, etc.), thrusting with head and body exposed, over committing, etc. In your unarmed sparring video, you are in orthodox stance; in your fencing video, you are in southpaw stance, showing different mechanics.

The mechanics for Shuaibeishou that you showed in striking the leaf would generate more whipping power, if you use the kinetic chain: the hips, then shoulders rotate before the arm which I have seen in Tongbei videos.

I look to fencing for their fencing concepts, not power generation. Rapier and dagger or shield mechanics are more applicable to unarmed fighting, than what you showed in your fencing video:

Tonight the Shenfa for Longsword and Rapier fencing were completely different from each other and from what I do. When I tried my hand at Rapier fencing a lot of what I learned was not applicable, even my foundation training. I can't wait to try my hand at other types of weapons.

The "switching stances" you showed in your sparring video is called "shift punching" which Jack Dempsey, boxers, MMA fighters and others use.

I see more success in marketing fencing, weapons, or system with China story (Peacedog's suggestions), not helping MMA fighters. You might have success marketing as Bruce Frantzis has with the China background.

The weapons/empty hand thing is why FMA and Xingyiquan have a certain appeal. If the shtick is "self defence", weapons at hand ties into this. Pick up a phone, an umbrella, a mug, a pen, a bottle, a frozen ham, whatever. You should be able to do you.

Life is way too short to be a "prepper" though. People want to feel like a badass, but they want to have fun. This sparring seems like a ton of fun.

Marketing wise, it may be hard to find the "messaging" in a crowded market.

[MaartenSFS]

For example, this is SGM Vining. He is a legendary retired Delta Operator. He looks like a Sunday school teacher.



Now this is Shrek. Another retired Delta operator.

https://sobtactical.com/about/

Who looks more dangerous?

Which one would you want to learn CQB from and which one would you prefer to have a lecture on force protection in the developing world from?

Haha, point taken. I'm probably somewhere in between..

I'll check out Instagram. All of these things were blocked in China, so it was hard to get the word out. I'll have to try different approaches now that I'm out. I was kind of expecting people to jump on this, but reality sucks. I'm going to finish up filming some more stuff this week and get the ball rolling. I've also been working on doing the things that I've been writing articles about.

[MaartenSFS]

Okay, I think maybe you misunderstood me or I wasn't clear.. In the OP I was talking about determining the focus for your system and I mentioned sparring and wrestling and then my personal situation with fencing. I was not implying that my swordsmanship system is the best way to learn unarmed fighting. I was merely stating that the focus of my swordsmanship system is to get my students to become proficient at fencing and that the entire curriculum is centred around it. That being said, the mechanics for Shuaibeishou are identical in my swordsmanship and unarmed fighting and the mechanics of Zhenjin are the same whether punching or thrusting, so there is great overlap and learning any type of good swordsmanship will greatly enhance your unarmed fighting, I promise you. This is something that really surprised me during my own training. It's not just switching stances. It's not that simple. In the OP I also mentioned my unarmed system and its focus on hand techniques. I'm not sure where the confusion stems from, but I hope that I've cleared it up now.

The mechanics I was referring to are holding the sword with two hands, swinging it (e.g., over your head, etc.), thrusting with head and body exposed, over committing, etc. In your unarmed sparring video, you are in orthodox stance; in your fencing video, you are in southpaw stance, showing different mechanics.

The mechanics for Shuaibeishou that you showed in striking the leaf would generate more whipping power, if you use the kinetic chain: the hips, then shoulders rotate before the arm which I have seen in Tongbei videos.

I look to fencing for their fencing concepts, not power generation. Rapier and dagger or shield mechanics are more applicable to unarmed fighting, than what you showed in your fencing video:

Tonight the Shenfa for Longsword and Rapier fencing were completely different from each other and from what I do. When I tried my hand at Rapier fencing a lot of what I learned was not applicable, even my foundation training. I can't wait to try my hand at other types of weapons.

The "switching stances" you showed in your sparring video is called "shift punching" which Jack Dempsey, boxers, MMA fighters and others use.

I see more success in marketing fencing, weapons, or system with China story (Peacedog's suggestions), not helping MMA fighters. You might have success marketing as Bruce Frantzis has with the China background.

The weapons/empty hand thing is why FMA and Xingyiquan have a certain appeal. If the shtick is "self defence", weapons at hand ties into this. Pick up a phone, an umbrella, a mug, a pen, a bottle, a frozen ham, whatever. You should be able to do you.

Life is way too short to be a "prepper" though. People want to feel like a badass, but they want to have fun. This sparring seems like a ton of fun.

Marketing wise, it may be hard to find the "messaging" in a crowded market.

The stance is reversed, the mechanics are not. Shuaibeishou is not only about whipping - that has more to do with speed and accuracy. In that same video you can see and hear me swinging at target pads. I can assure you that the power is the same as a lot of the one-handed and even some two-handed sword techniques. The strategy of Tongbeiquan and Shanzhaidao are similar. This is not a gentleman's Jianfa. It's mean and only cares about results.

It's not over-committing if you can generate the type of power that will force people to react in a way that helps you. I'm also doing a lot of feints to set up my larger movements. I'm using footwork to cover myself when my sword can't. There is a big difference between thrusting styles and cut and thrust styles. They are not the same at all and cannot be compared as such. You don't believe that this type of fencing is applicable because you don't understand the power being generated and how to use it in unarmed combat. I haven't seen it anywhere other than from my Master and one of his Gongfu brothers. It's scary.

I started with unarmed and worked my way towards armed and explicitly designed both systems to overlap as efficiently as possible. Perhaps rapier fencing will be more applicable to other unarmed arts, but those are not what I teach. I'm not marketing to MMA fighters, I'm marketing to those that want to get good at Chinese sabre fencing and/or unarmed sparring. Since this won't be my day job I don't care if I lose some students along the way. I couldn't stomach teaching them anyways.

Anyways, if you still want to question my art then by all means please stop by and pick up a "sword" and see for yourself. I don't believe you'll find it lacking, as the HEMA guys didn't, some with many, many years of experience in both modern and historical fencing.

Here's a video of Tongbeiquan, which has a lot of similarities with what I do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU1bhS-SddI.
The swinging strikes are pretty much identical in training and application, but the punches are totally different - more like Xingyiquan. It's a great combination.

[HotSoup]

Here's a video of Tongbeiquan, which has a lot of similarities with what I do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU1bhS-SddI.

One of the best vids on CMA I've ever watched. If your stuff is similar, you should be on the right way.

[MaartenSFS]

You've seen it before? I was just looking for some Tongbeiquan videos to see just how similar it is to what I was taught and was surprised at how much of it was. Not really the techniques themselves, but the method of training. The biggest difference is that we also do these with footwork and also with weights (but they may too). There is another Tongbeiquan video in which a master is hitting a lot of pads similar to how I do it in my video. I agree that this stuff is amazing and the power that can generated is scary. I think that so few people have trained in this way that most haven't experienced it and don't take it seriously. Of course I use this stuff is sparring as well.

[Bao]

Yes, good exercises. Many of these and similar are practiced generally in IMA. Maybe most in Bagua, but also in XY and TJQ. I used to have a few of these and other arm swings as warm up in my classes.

I agree that this stuff is amazing and the power that can generated is scary. I think that so few people have trained in this way that most haven't experienced it and don't take it seriously. Of course I use this stuff is sparring as well.

Most people don't take it very seriously, not even people who learned them. IME, you need to practice them for quite some time before you can be loose enough to really understand the type of power you can generate with this kind of movement.

[MaartenSFS]

Yes, good exercises. Many of these and similar are practiced generally in IMA. Maybe most in Bagua, but also in XY and TJQ. I used to have a few of these and other arm swings as warm up in my classes.

I agree that this stuff is amazing and the power that can generated is scary. I think that so few people have trained in this way that most haven't experienced it and don't take it seriously. Of course I use this stuff is sparring as well.

Most people don't take it very seriously, not even people who learned them. IME, you need to practice them for quite some time before you can be loose enough to really understand the type of power you can generate with this kind of movement.

I use them as both warm-ups and for foundation training. I agree that it takes some time to learn it and become loose enough, but far, far less than most of the skills found in Taijiquan. Thankfully I chose what skills I wanted carefully and actually did what my Master told me to do. Honestly that's why so few people are good. They just don't train anywhere near enough. And then they don't spar either...

[johnwang]

Here's a video of Tongbeiquan, which has a lot of similarities with what I do: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU1bhS-SddI.

I like this kind of training. No forms but drills. If you want to create video like this, I'll suggest you to put application first and how to train solo after. You show the goal first. You then help people how to reach to that goal.

[Appledog]

For example, if 75-80% of Taijiquan is Shuaifa/Qinna and how to counter them, the focus should probably be on gaining those skills and how to use them in wrestling (since Tuishou as it should be practised is way too limiting, in my opinion, to be considered as fighting or wrestling). The teacher should be able to handle themselves quite well in wrestling and use most of these techniques in the curriculum against a fully resisting opponent. The striking aspects can also be taught, but more as additional self-defence techniques when the shit hits the fan.

I'd be willing to accept a lot less given today's tai chi environment. If you have a teacher who has an interesting form, half decent qigong and can do push hands properly and well (say, any push hands instructional by name brand teachers) you are already at the 90th percentile of all tai chi players in the world (and this, is only counting the ones who stick with it over their lifetime). This automatically puts you in a special place and is good enough for making progress on your own or finding a good teacher. You cannot find a good teacher right off the bat, unless you are connected or very lucky. For Americans I don't think it is really possible anymore, unless I suppose you're just very lucky. Like a green card lottery.

I really think the biggest problem with people trying to learn Tai Chi is their morality and humility. They get stuck on random concepts and become unteachable. This can happen in good ways and bad ways, sometimes it's not desirable to go with a teacher simply because you are too used to doing things a certain (but good) way too, and it's better that you practice on your own for a while. But even with that you have to come out of it sometime and go find a teacher again.

[johnwang]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU1bhS-SddI

I have cross trained the white ape Tongbei when I was yonng. There are so many circular moves that I have never used in sparring. Is Tongbei an effective CMA system? I honest have some doubt on it.

IMO, Tongbei is too circular. WC is too linear. Both are too extreme. The preying mantis is something in between.

[MaartenSFS]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU1bhS-SddI

I have cross trained the white ape Tongbei when I was yonng. There are so many circular moves that I have never used in sparring. Is Tongbei an effective CMA system? I honest have some doubt on it.

IMO, Tongbei is too circular. WC is too linear. Both are too extreme. The preying mantis is something in between.

Remember that Shanzhaiquan only uses the core part of Tongbeiquan, namely the power-generating method. The actual techniques are from various arts. Then Zhenjin from XYLHQ and XY footwork is added. It's like Tongbei arms, XYLH hands and Xingyi fists, so it's not all circles. I still think that Tongbiquan by itself is way more effective than Wingchun, though. I don't use any of the WC I was taught in sparring. Or anywhere else.

Have a look at this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWAWhwhAqLU

I have seen videos from this school before. It looks like a really good place to train, if they spar too.

[MaartenSFS]

For example, if 75-80% of Taijiquan is Shuaifa/Qinna and how to counter them, the focus should probably be on gaining those skills and how to use them in wrestling (since Tuishou as it should be practised is way too limiting, in my opinion, to be considered as fighting or wrestling). The teacher should be able to handle themselves quite well in wrestling and use most of these techniques in the curriculum against a fully resisting opponent. The striking aspects can also be taught, but more as additional self-defence techniques when the shit hits the fan.

I'd be willing to accept a lot less given today's tai chi environment. If you have a teacher who has an interesting form, half decent qigong and can do push hands properly and well (say, any push hands instructional by name brand teachers) you are already at the 90th percentile of all tai chi players in the world (and this, is only counting the ones who stick with it over their lifetime). This automatically puts you in a special place and is good enough for making progress on your own or finding a good teacher. You cannot find a good teacher right off the bat, unless you are connected or very lucky. For Americans I don't think it is really possible anymore, unless I suppose you're just very lucky. Like a green card lottery.

I really think the biggest problem with people trying to learn Tai Chi is their morality and humility. They get stuck on random concepts and become unteachable. This can happen in good ways and bad ways, sometimes it's not desirable to go with a teacher simply because you are too used to doing things a certain (but good) way too, and it's better that you practice on your own for a while. But even with that you have to come out of it sometime and go find a teacher again.

What you are describing is not a martial art. Call it Taiji Qigong and leave out the Quan and I'd be fine with it, like Taebo or Boxercise.

[Bao]

There are so many circular moves that I have never used in sparring. Is Tongbei an effective CMA system? I honest have some doubt on it.

IMO, Tongbei is too circular. WC is too linear. Both are too extreme. The preying mantis is something in between.

IMO it's the body method, the engine, which is important, not the actual techniques or that the style must look like this or that. You can use the body mechanics of the large circular movements to drive smaller linear movements.

So if the art becomes an effective combat art or not depends on the teacher and on the student. As always.