## Just the circle ⭕️

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

### Just the circle ⭕️

Help, in walking the circle, what is most important?
The point . is absolute
Wanderingdragon
Wuji

Posts: 6239
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:33 pm
Location: Chgo Il

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Ooh, a riddle!

Timing?
Last edited by Tatanka on Tue Oct 30, 2018 3:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Tatanka
Santi

Posts: 11
Joined: Fri Oct 17, 2014 1:29 pm

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Not a riddle, an interest, is it like moving Zhan Zhuang, should I seek the connection, or follow the progression, breath and breathing, I am starting to try and use it as a simple exercise, but I want to be correct in how I perform it.
The point . is absolute
Wanderingdragon
Wuji

Posts: 6239
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:33 pm
Location: Chgo Il

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

The most important things are that your Xiapan remains stable, that the angle of your steps is correct so that your opponent can't turn fast enough and that your Shangpan is threatening your opponent so that you aren't caught mid-step. Exactly how you step isn't as important.

MaartenSFS
Wuji

Posts: 2057
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 8:22 pm
Location: Holt, Michigan

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

it really depends on what method of circle walking you are following

there are many ways to do it...
and each school says they are doing it the right way...
Franklin
Great Old One

Posts: 1219
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 5:56 am
Location: Taipei, Taiwan

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Maarten, Xiapan and Shangpan ?
The point . is absolute
Wanderingdragon
Wuji

Posts: 6239
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:33 pm
Location: Chgo Il

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Just the circle looks empty, put a dot in the middle of it
Trick
Wuji

Posts: 1816
Joined: Sat Jul 23, 2016 1:30 am

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Upper and lower half of the body.

MaartenSFS
Wuji

Posts: 2057
Joined: Thu Oct 03, 2013 8:22 pm
Location: Holt, Michigan

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Depends on style, lineage and teacher what they would suggest. There are many different ideas. Maybe reading Sun Lutangs general advice is a good start.

https://brennantranslation.wordpress.co ... un-lutang/
Thoughts on Tai Chi (My Tai Chi blog)
- Storms make oaks take deeper root. -George Herbert
- To affect the quality of the day, is the highest of all arts! -Walden Thoreau
Bao
Great Old One

Posts: 6650
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 12:46 pm
Location: High up north

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Most of the important requirements are the same as when doing zz, but han xiong ba bei is even more important as the stepping around tends to cause the lumbar to come back in, which empties the Dantian, which in turn doesn’t allow the vena cava to be full, which will cause qi to rise.
So for just circle turning, I would say that Scissor Leg Stepping is important. It’s where you keep your knees rubbing past one another to keep your stepping straight, or knees tracking straight as your legs go past one another. Only at the very end of the stride will you either open the inside foot or hook in the outside, and if your leg has tracked straight then the opened foot will cause you to have to naturally move your knee through its full range of motion. Circle turning should strengthen your knees. If they end up hurting from it then something is drastically wrong. Doing circle turning should strengthen your thigh muscles and you will only be able to rub them together and your knee’s won’t be able to touch, which is what you want, and the second important point is to walk in the lowest stance that you can. Keeping the Dantian full, walking low. It should be an invigorating exercise. If you’re qi begins to rise (if you’re out of breath then it’s already risen) then slowly raise up to a higher stance. Find the balance between the most vigorous practice you can get, yet still a meditative practice and maintaining a calmness. Think of it like hiking up a beautiful mountain. Strengthen the legs, increase the size of your thighs, so that you are practicing ‘Scissor thigh stepping’, as the knees rubbing is too narrow of a stance.
Last edited by D_Glenn on Wed Oct 31, 2018 7:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

D_Glenn
Great Old One

Posts: 4759
Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 4:04 pm

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Or another way to describe the Scissor leg stepping is that you only want the sides of the knees or sides of the thighs sliding by one another. You definitely don’t want, say, the back of the knee of the inside leg, moving past the side of the knee on the outside leg, because you’re trying to do the open step to early. You don’t want to soccer ball kick with the inside leg.

.

D_Glenn
Great Old One

Posts: 4759
Joined: Fri May 16, 2008 4:04 pm

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

WD, we use the first palm to walk the circle in our lineage. Body straight, relax, sit low, drop to the ground with tailbone down, twist the body to face the center. shift your balance to one leg, move the other leg forward with foot flat and parallel to the ground all the time (one cm above the ground), shift the body balance to the other leg once it is on the ground, lift the leg at the back with the foot flat (not transfer from heel to toe), and move forward with scissor leg. The hip is the engine. Foot always flat is a must.

suckinlhbf
Huajing

Posts: 290
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:46 pm

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

Thanks DGlenn, you have offered much of what I wanted as a beginner, the stepping should be flat footed for stability? I think I have been erroneously landing while pulling forward with the toes. But my greatest concern was constantly trying to maintain the dantien, Air always rising. Ah Thank also Suckinliuhabafa much to co wider and quite clearly explaained.
Last edited by Wanderingdragon on Wed Oct 31, 2018 10:40 am, edited 1 time in total.
The point . is absolute
Wanderingdragon
Wuji

Posts: 6239
Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 12:33 pm
Location: Chgo Il

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

wouldn't you be better served by asking yourself what you want to get out of circle walking?

if you don't know what circle walking is -- how do you know it will give you what you want?

if you have a clearly defined goal - then you can start to look for what it is you want...

if you don't have a clearly defined goal- then what led you to believe that circle walking would be of benefit?
maybe start there- and pursue the path that you are interested...

---- that said - circle walking is difficult to do right...

sink the body
stabilize the hips

upper body turns in to the center of the circle
(some schools have the hips turn to the outside of the circle- counter to the upper body twist)

feet follow the path of the circle

walking a smaller circle is more twist on the whole body
bigger circle is less twist

legs like scissors - pass close to each other
ankles pass close to each other

depending on the walking -- 2 main methods but lots of other ones too

-- the foot rolls into the ground (heel toe) and shift into then step and repeat
feels like you are a giant ball rolling forward when you get it right
lower body heavy and stable rolling forward

-- the foot "sniffs" the ground like a dog's nose.. and lands flat
you can either take a normal step
or you can step forward - then before the foot hits - push off the rear foot and step an extra couple inches to a foot
when the foot lands - it is already the "back" leg
this walking should feel like you are gliding along the ground
a good image to work with is you are walking on ice..
in that when the front foot lands - it needs to land flat and stable - other wise if you were on ice you would slip and fall
as it lands it already has the whole weight of the body
so the feeling is you are light
as the foot "sniffs" forward - have soem intention of the forward knee going forward..
so its not like you see in a lot of poeple's videos- witht he weight on the back leg and the forward foot reaching way out all by itself..

walking should have no start or stop

nothing in the body should start or stop--
it should all be smooth- no jerkiness

walk for a good amount of time..
1 hour minimum a day

when i learned originally it was walking 15 min on direction
then change and do 15 the other direction
so 4 changes in an hour...

good luck
Franklin
Great Old One

Posts: 1219
Joined: Tue May 13, 2008 5:56 am
Location: Taipei, Taiwan

### Re: Just the circle ⭕️

WD,
flat footed for stability

More than stability. There is a difference in body movements, and mechanic. Try to walk a 100 circles, and you will know. Go step by step before you can move smoothly.
Last edited by suckinlhbf on Wed Oct 31, 2018 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

suckinlhbf
Huajing

Posts: 290
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 1:46 pm

Next

Return to Xingyiquan - Baguazhang - Taijiquan

### Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest