Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby windwalker on Tue Nov 13, 2018 6:43 pm

.None of that's got anything to do with the hero's journey of a known fraud who came to believe his own bullshit and abandoned taijiquan the first time he got his ass handed to him.

. His failure, and the failure of whatever other people we may find on video, do not one thing to diminish the value of my practice or my faith in the efficacy of the methods and techniques that comprise it.

. It's always been there when I need it, in and outside of friendly exchanges. I'll note that it does not involve rotting watermelons with chi power.


You seem to know a lot about the guy calling him a fraud commenting on his training, who he's tested against, and who he has not.

As far as abandoning taiji or not. most on this site comment as to others practices of why they don't practice for what they feel is the purpose of their practice.

His comment reflects his own viewpoint, and in general could be said of the consensus of this site in that most people do not practice taiji as a combative art intending to use it as such.

I would tend to agree. This does not diminish the usefulness of it nor the purpose for whatever one assigns to it or their practice.

whenever I work with people I always make sure they understand what they're looking for and expect and direct them to those that would be better suited to their own expectations when it's not in line with the things I worked on.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby oragami_itto on Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:02 pm

windwalker wrote:
.None of that's got anything to do with the hero's journey of a known fraud who came to believe his own bullshit and abandoned taijiquan the first time he got his ass handed to him.

. His failure, and the failure of whatever other people we may find on video, do not one thing to diminish the value of my practice or my faith in the efficacy of the methods and techniques that comprise it.

. It's always been there when I need it, in and outside of friendly exchanges. I'll note that it does not involve rotting watermelons with chi power.


You seem to know a lot about the guy calling him a fraud commenting on his training, who he's tested against, and who he has not.


I call him a fraud because he gives fraudulent demos. He had assistants damage a watermelon beforehand so he could claim to have rotted the inside with a penetrating chi strike. He also taped a bird to his hand to make it look like he was preventing it from flying with his sensitivity and yielding. Fraudulent.

As far as abandoning taiji or not. most on this site comment as to others practices of why they don't practice for what they feel is the purpose of their practice.

To put it plainly. The claim has been made that people need to go out and fight publicly and win in order to "save ima" that is the first point I'm arguing against.
The second is that if IMA does need saving by such means, Wei Lei, self-proclaimed grandmaster of his own style of Taijiquan, known performer of spurious demonstrations, who has abandoned taijiquan as a combat art after being badly beaten, is not the one to do so.
His comment reflects his own viewpoint, and in general could be said of the consensus of this site in that most people do not practice taiji as a combative art intending to use it as such.

I would have to agree that the vast majority of people who practice exercises known as Tai Chi are not practicing for self defense or combat sports purposes.

I would tend to agree. This does not diminish the usefulness of it nor the purpose for whatever one assigns to it or their practice.

whenever I work with people I always make sure they understand what they're looking for and expect and direct them to those that would be better suited to their own expectations when it's not in line with the things I worked on.

If someone told me they wanted to be an MMA fighter, I would not send them to a taijiquan school.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby windwalker on Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:17 pm

You've alleged that he did these things with no proof backing up your allegations.

You've, attributed motive for his actions.

My comments are only reflective of what is shown.
The case of why or how he does his demos or for what he's doing his practice for is not clear.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby Steve James on Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:20 pm

I agree that a student should have a clear goal. The instructor should be chosen based on his or her ability to help the student achieve his goal. If the goal is to learn self-defense, then a teacher who knows how to train someone to do that should be sought. If the goal is personal improvement, or if it's to compete in the UFC, the same is true. d

IF Wei says that tcc isn't useful for self-defense, that's based on his experience with it. Was that his goal? Did he learn from someone who did tcc for self-defense? If before his first bout he claimed that tcc could be used for self-defense, then he is a fraud. Otoh, if he did his form regularly and was convinced that it would work against someone (who claimed that tcc was bs), then he was simply deluding himself --and anyone he taught.

As it is, though, Wei is just a guy with claims and not much experience. Anybody could do the same. Claiming to represent tcc means nothing. He can only represent himself.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby Wanderingdragon on Tue Nov 13, 2018 7:45 pm

When a teacher knows how to fight it is evident in their desire and presence.

https://youtu.be/I6-7AqbjwSc
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby Strange on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:20 pm

it is true that everyone is entitled to their own views and opinion
if someone wears a fake watch or jewelry, we can still say its very nice. it does not harm anyone.
but MA is not a watch or jewelry
if you fake it, you can seriously harm yourself.
and if you put yourself out as a master and teach fake skills
then i do not think it is alright to sit on the fence about it
we have to say it is fraudulent
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby johnwang on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:31 pm

Steve James wrote: Wei is just a guy with claims and not much experience.

Something doesn't make sense here. If he has

- not sparred for 1,000 rounds, he will not try to fight on stage.
- sparred for 1,000 rounds, he should do better than this.

What's wrong in my logic?
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby Steve James on Tue Nov 13, 2018 9:48 pm

If he has

- not sparred for 1,000 rounds, he will not try to fight on stage.
- sparred for 1,000 rounds, he should do better than this.

What's wrong in my logic?


It would be logical for him to have sparred, but there's no law that makes anyone logical. There's no logical reason he wouldn't have sparred or practiced fighting before entering a public competition. The answer might be irrational self-delusion. However, self-delusion isn't uncommon in the martial arts.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby johnwang on Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:14 pm

Steve James wrote:There's no logical reason he wouldn't have sparred or practiced fighting before entering a public competition.

Trying not to make yourself look like a fool is just common sense. When you go to another MA school, if you see a double heads on the ground, you don't just pick it up. If you fail, it will make you look bad. Your teacher always tells you that you need to use your foot to hook up that double heads to feel whether you can handle that weight or not.

It's better to lose off the stage than to lose on the stage. If you think that you don't have more than 50% chance to win, you should not fight.
Last edited by johnwang on Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby oragami_itto on Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:17 am

johnwang wrote:
Steve James wrote:There's no logical reason he wouldn't have sparred or practiced fighting before entering a public competition.

Trying not to make yourself look like a fool is just common sense. When you go to another MA school, if you see a double heads on the ground, you don't just pick it up. If you fail, it will make you look bad. Your teacher always tells you that you need to use your foot to hook up that double heads to feel whether you can handle that weight or not.

It's better to lose off the stage than to lose on the stage. If you think that you don't have more than 50% chance to win, you should not fight.


I mean just take a look at the guy in action and tell me he had any business representing anything anywhere at any time. It's a joke. And this is where he had full control of the environment and rules of engagement!

Last edited by oragami_itto on Wed Nov 14, 2018 6:17 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby Steve James on Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:00 am

I don't like to argue about people, especially martial artists. What Wei does has no effect on me or tcc. John is right that the guy was being irrational if he thought he could use what he does in a competition. However, I can't hate on the guy because there are far more people who say they could use what they practice, but have never tried or had to do so. The number of trained people who use their arts in "real" life is probably greater than the number of people who compete.

I.e., there are a handful of dedicated tcc schools whose students compete in open competitions with other arts. Nobody does "just" tcc in mma because nobody does "just one thing" in mma by definition. Athletes may have bases in a particular art --such as karate, muay thai, or wrestling-- but they have to adapt to the context.

Everyone I know whose base is/was tcc who competes is not considered a "tcc" person or using tcc. The Practical tcc guys in the UK have a tradition of competition, for example. But, 90% of all tcc schools don't compete. Of the 10% that do, most do so at specialized "tcc" competitions. So, imo, if Wei was deluded enough to think that he could enter a competition without training, it still makes him less a fraud than teachers who make claims but never have to back them up.

Btw, imo, the solution is simply not to make claims. As ya'll have said, doing competitions is unnecessary and even counter-productive at some point. Imagine what would have happened if he had done better? Would that justify tcc? If I posted videos of "tcc" guys in competitions, would that restore tcc's reputation? Then again, that's the job of the people who make the claims.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby oragami_itto on Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:15 am

Steve James wrote:Btw, imo, the solution is simply not to make claims. As ya'll have said, doing competitions is unnecessary and even counter-productive at some point. Imagine what would have happened if he had done better? Would that justify tcc? If I posted videos of "tcc" guys in competitions, would that restore tcc's reputation? Then again, that's the job of the people who make the claims.
I admit I'd be more prone to sing his payday as a champion of the art if he'd won.

But of course he didn't and the more I see him the less I think of him, honestly. He didn't embody the art or use the art and by all appearances has since abandoned the art, so the only thing he's really accomplishing by" representing" is damage to the brand.

Again, that's not really important to me, but respect is the last thing I'll extend to him for that
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby Steve James on Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:24 am

A video or demonstration that makes tcc respected is about as likely to find as a video with no dislikes.
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby everything on Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:43 am

"soft" arts are proven in the mma format already. usually bjj, but also judo, sambo, etc. ... if he said his taijiquan helped his other 'soft' art, or that's what he tried to learn, maybe it would be different...
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Re: Wei Lei (taiji guy) lost again

Postby oragami_itto on Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:12 am

Steve James wrote:A video or demonstration that makes tcc respected is about as likely to find as a video with no dislikes.


Fair enough. But what, short of an MMA victory, which by nature and definition would necessarily include cross training in at least jiujitsu for ground work, and maybe some striking specially art to flesh out the boxing toolkit, and don't forget the cardio, at which point what does it even have to do with demonstrating taijiquan efficacy, would be universally accepted as respectable?

Understanding in both depth and scope and perspectives and experience is all so varied, with so much ego and insecurity on the line in the mix, consensus beyond the most superficial and fundamental aspects is beyond impossible.

Video is pointless, basically. First hand experience is the only thing worth anything
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