the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

Rhen wrote:

oragami_itto wrote:

Steve James wrote:
Edit: I happened to recall the idea of the "five fists" in tcc, but I couldn't remember where I'd seen it written down. Anyway, I did a quick search and found this.

Well here's an idea of it.

that guy is on the martial man and adam mizner fake taiji propaganda machine. I've seen the videos of him doing the fake pushing on his students. And I've seen the video of him getting pushed (literally owned) by a taiji teacher in the park in Thailand. He lost face then told everyone the other guy didnt use taiji. He isnt very good. He just has good marketing friends.

Good thing we have you lurking in the shadows to lurch out anytime anyone mentions any of them and remind us how fake they are.

Good thing we have you lurking in the shadows to lurch out anytime anyone mentions any of them and remind us how fake they are.

you mean like the straight boxing punch Adam does with his student obviously telegraphing and then faking a knockout?

Rhen wrote:

Good thing we have you lurking in the shadows to lurch out anytime anyone mentions any of them and remind us how fake they are.

you mean like the straight boxing punch Adam does with his student obviously telegraphing and then faking a knockout?

You should put out your own material, show us how to do it correctly.

Rhen wrote:
that guy is on the martial man and adam mizner fake taiji propaganda machine. I've seen the videos of him doing the fake pushing on his students. And I've seen the video of him getting pushed (literally owned) by a taiji teacher in the park in Thailand. He lost face then told everyone the other guy didnt use taiji. He isnt very good. He just has good marketing friends.

I have seen that vid as well, really embarrassing! Sorry, can't post it, as it was protected, someone doesn't want it to go public, lol!

Hello, I'd like to maintain a 'cool post count' of 108 posts. This particular post has gone beyond that number and has therefore expired.

I'm sorry if you were looking for some old information but I'll do my best to answer you if you send me a DM with a question in it.

The problem with what you are saying is by th time these people come to you they are almost unteachable
If they don't give up after a bad expierence
There are two schools I won't accept students from,it's too frustrating
Not only do they have bad physical problems but mental as well

Appledog wrote:

oragami_itto wrote:You should put out your own material, show us how to do it correctly.

He just did.

Sorry but standing up for having been properly taught the art you just don't do this and call it Tai Chi.

Some years back there was an incident on Chinese TV which everyone knows exactly what I am talking about that damaged the reputation of a big name teacher in China. So I am just saying everyone knows about it even if you don't get the reference. I bring it up as an example, of how damaging something like this can be. It will always be in the background, this big name teacher, cheated and lied to people about what Tai Chi is and what it can do. "Why?" we asked, with a feeling of betrayal. So I think, deep down, people know. I'll use crossover knowledge from being an English teacher in Taiwan. When there is a bad school, for whatever reason, but especially when the boss spreads rumors and attacks other teachers and schools, I have noticed a peculiar social phenomenon. A lot of low-class and unintelligent kids flock to that school, while intelligent and rich parents tend to go try out the other school. I'm not sure to what degree this is true, but I've see it enough to know that there is a financial benefit to not being overly critical of people who don't deserve it. Ultimately I think, "people just know". Because they're not "really" beginners.

If anybody wants to come forward and defend or debate their own actions, they are more than welcome to do so. I have no interest or business in defending Adam Mizner. That said those three frames don't mean anything to me and don't bear discussion. His online/video course is fantastic, and if you are aware of a better one I would definitely appreciate the tip and follow up on it.

In our world the topic that comes up is how can a beginner know which teacher is good and which teacher is cheating or a waste of time. The truth is that a beginner can't know. A beginner also can't know when a dissenting voice is telling the truth about someone being fake or not. Or who is trolling or not. The solution is, stop being a beginner. I think most people here aren't beginners and they really know the truth, but maybe they are a little too attached to something to have fully open eyes. Learn the art, learn who you can trust and who you shouldn't, and stop posting your opinion of truth and falsehood in martial arts until you are not a beginner anymore. I'm not making a demand I'm pleading, because my eyes and ears burn whenever I read a thread like this, like I am hearing discordant music. Why does this stuff have to go on in our community, I don't know. I know that these people often have good intentions. But that is sometimes not good enough if it leads to ignorance, and then to needless conflict. Please do not be a party to "the crime of creating ignorance".

I am definitely a beginner. I appreciate your perspective, and your concern for my own training and the damage my conversation is doing in setting back taijiquan as a whole. I always strive to do better.

My irritation with Rhen is simply that the only time this person posts is every time Adam Mizner or his associates comes up. I've seen nothing of Rhen's own skill or interest other than defamation of Mizner's character that comes straight out of the yahoos at the fajin project's posts. I mean literally straight from there, not even original thought. Including that stupid ass three panel graphic.

So I'm just asking the person behind the puppet to participate beyond his slander. Give us an idea of their own skill and contribution to help balance all the fakery. Instead of focusing on trying to tear someone down, put some energy into spreading positive messages and good examples of quality taijiquan instead of the same old knitting-circle gossip and backbiting.

I don't expect any response from that person though, probably just another round of posting messages to everyone's websites pretending to be me again.

If you can't see how Yang and Wu style BKTS can be a strike (palm or changed to fist), then you should all just give up and go home.
It can be other things, but if it can't be a strike in your style then you're missing a trick for sure.

Anyway the style I'm doing now uses it as a strike and so have the styles I have been taught previously.
Do what you want, but don't try to tell me it's not or can't be a strike.

That's just beyond stupid.

another thing....

If you feel you have to find something as simplistic as a rear hand strike, straight or cross 'formalized' in your form to make it tai chi... palm or fist..
I feel more than sorry for you, whoever you are.

a symptomatic crying shame of a thing.
this is.

The last "rear hand strike" in the following form (at 0.30) was added in by GM Han Chin-Tang because the original form didn't have any "rear hand strike". I believe when GM Han did that, he was in his 40th.

If you think your Taiji doesn't have "rear hand strike". why don't you add it in yourself?

johnwang wrote:The last "rear hand strike" in the following form (at 0.30) was added in by GM Han Chin-Tang because the original form didn't have any "rear hand strike". I believe when GM Han did that, he was in his 40th.

If you think your Taiji doesn't have "rear hand strike". why don't you add it in yourself?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ECyH84mkt5A

The core of what seem to be many misunderstandings

"your taiji"

For many they are preserving others taiji, the lens they look through and judge things by.
Interesting in that many of the founders yang, wu, sun, chen, your teacher all found "their" taiji
Either named after them or the villages they came from.

My own teacher once told me

"once you reach a certain point, you can name it what you want"
The problem of course reaching that point, being acknowledged by
others as having done so.

You don't want to be just a copy machine for the rest of your life. At some point of your life, you have to start to train for yourself.

There is a big difference between "My style doesn't have ... (this is your teacher's problem)" vs. "I don't have ... (this is your problem)".

When are people going to get it through their skulls that the 3 Internal arts are for training and developing a body quality and learning to use whole body power. The forms are not like other styles of martial arts that use their forms to try to categorize or hold all the techniques of a martial art.
The internal arts (especially tjq) are more a blend of qigong and martial-esque movements, which results in a form that is neither a qigong or a distinct collection of martial technique.
A fight is a fight. If you see a person fighting and it looks like they’re using techniques from a tjq form, then that person is probably a shitty fighter, and really shouldn’t be trying to fight anyone, until they go back to the drawing board.

You can’t see the ‘body quality’, as an onlooker, unless you know what you’re looking for. And knowing what to look for comes from developing the quality in your own body.

Practice the CIMA as it’s been passed down, to develop the ‘body quality’ and whole-body power (wbp), but try to add that into your own personal manner of fighting. But ‘meeting/blending’ with the opponent’s attack is always the priority as you can never really dictate what’s happening in a fight and how you will need to move in order to blend. And you can’t truly train blending but hope that the quality and frame you developed will help you to adapt. Some martial techniques can’t really make use of wbp, but you need to figure that out for yourself.

I could go on. But I think I got the point across. Hopefully

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Why call it tai chi

You can call it whatever you want. If you were living in China, and weren’t trying to open a school, then you would be trying to hide the fact that you even practiced a martial art.

There’s basically 3 types of CIMA practitioners:
A) brawlers, hear about tjq etc as being the best martial arts, so they immediately try to deform them into what they already practice. Discard the traditional rules of the CIMA, and then spend the rest of their life deriding them.

B) the Shaw Brothers kung fu watching type, again hears about tjq etc as being the best martial arts, but they mistakenly believe that when they use CIMA to fight that it will look just like a kung fu movie.

C)various background fighters, but come open-minded, and listen to the CIMA teacher who tells them to follow the rules, but also tells them WHY the rules exist, which traditionally doesn’t get told to the student until after they begin to really develop the intended ‘body-quality’ and wbp.

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