Pre workout nutrition

[origami_itto]

I saw one of these MMA types hyping the value of a pre workout shake that's all protein and caffeine and wondered if any of you have a pre or post workout supplement or nutrition recommendation.

[everything]

For soccer games, I try to avoid eating, and definitely avoid heavy foods, for 3 hours beforehand. Might have a little fruit an hour before (quicker to digest, a little bit of sugar boost). Usually don't have caffeine but have tried it, and it can help with some initial faster play. If I ate an hour before or ate something heavy, I can definitely feel the bad effect.

For just general exercise, I mostly use "grease the groove" with kb swings + some tgu, sometimes some tai chi, so don't pay attention to the above kind of timing.

Post workout, I used to try to have a little protein. Have slacked off for that. Mostly try to rehydrate quite a lot. Don't really use electrolytes (maybe should).

[Trick]

Back in high school a classmate use to eat a big bag of cheese doodles before his weight training workouts. He eventually became quite big(muscular). There where rumors about steroids, but it could have been the doodles that did it ?

[Dmitri]

Food only after workout, for me. Think evolution..

[origami_itto]

Well that's how I've pretty much done things all my life but I'm noticing things now.

I'm eating only between 12-8 so when I wake up it's nothing but coffee till noon. If I go to push hands at 10, or meet up with somebody to work on something else before noon, then I wind up gassing out easier. Particularly in the summer heat lately.

I mean I know I need to HTFU. But do I have to be so hungry?

[Steve James]

Whoa. There must be a tcma pov on this, but I don't know it. When I raced bikes, it was critical to eat before, during, and after workouts. I've never been a weightlifter, but I know they have to eat a lot. Bodybuilders eat all day --at least 4 or 5 times a day. My point is only that intake is directly related to energy (or calorie) expenditure.

Imo, it would be better to have a regular routine of small, "healthy", meals during the day --if you want to satisfy the craving to eat. Now, if you're doing heavy sparring or bjj, etc., it would probably be better not to eat directly before working out. Ok, I wouldn't go to dinner before phs practice, but that's just common sense. I don't think I'd puke if I have a big meal beforehand.

I also thought that the "nutrition" idea meant what type of food/s one would eat before working out. For me, it'd be eggs, yogurt, maybe a slice of toast, and a frozen fruit smoothee.

[Trick]

In Dalian I got up 6:00 (in the morning) prepared to go down to the park for my two hour TJQ/TBQ practice. Firstly two big cups of water, then one banana and one tomato, and if not have at home I grabbed on big meat-baozi at one of the breakfast vendors on my way to the park. This I found out was perfect for me, not full and not hungry, but gave the energy I needed.

On my way home from practice I enjoyed a burger, a whole-wheat muffin together with a big cup of coffee at the local coffee bar......Wow, how I miss that !

Nowadays I too usually don’t eat anything before 12:00 since i don’t do any serious morning practice anymore, but I like to have some late sandwich or something like it despite already eating a good dinner. I just get super hungry after my afternoon training.

[everything]

oragami, so you're doing "intermittent fasting"?
is this for weight loss purposes?

like steve said, i thought bodybuilders eat 6 meals a day.
not sure they can do that with a large fasting period.
also carbs in the morning, no fat.
fat in the evening, no carbs.

I've tried it and lost weight easily, but it is so hard to stick to it.

[origami_itto]

Yes, intermittent fasting is what it's called. Took off about ten pounds so far, but I think I'm plateuing, lol, need to start evolving. My early success this year was completely reversed when I started eating like an asshole again.

[everything]

ah yeah it's easy to get some initial progress.

but then I feel good and start "cheating" and ugh.

I think my renewed effort is to cut out more junk and only aim for a few pounds lost and then plateau deliberately for a while without regression.

[Steve James]

Jmo, but, fasting is good; fasting to lose weight only works if one keeps fasting. I.e., one changes one's dietary regime. Eating regularly, regardless of metabolism, is best. Then, the real question is what you eat.My advice is to find things that you like to eat --that are also healthy for you-- and make up a schedule for eating them regularly. If you're happy with that, forget everyone else.

[Bao]

I know nothing about these things, but my friend who is a physical therapist and studied nutrition said that right before a workout eating something small is a good idea, and that the best choice is something like half a portion of a pasta salad.

[everything]

Jmo, but, fasting is good; fasting to lose weight only works if one keeps fasting. I.e., one changes one's dietary regime. Eating regularly, regardless of metabolism, is best. Then, the real question is what you eat.My advice is to find things that you like to eat --that are also healthy for you-- and make up a schedule for eating them regularly. If you're happy with that, forget everyone else.

one "hack" that works for me is to make my own fruit smoothie. maybe add a little spinach (not enough so it takes like a vegetable smoothie). this adds a little fiber and fruit to my diet. then i eat that first (like as breakfast or before dinner). now just need more "hacks" to make myself eat more vegetables.

once those two are accomplished, at least for me, everything else gets easier (cut down on meats, dairy, sugary foods, processed foods, "white" carbs, alcohol, coffee...). I"m already slightly full with nutritious food, fairly satisfied so not just eating junk as a first impulse, feeling better about my choice so being a little more careful to keep the other choices healthier. vs. trying to "subtract" instead of "add" is a bit difficult.

my other "hack" that i haven't accomplished is to make a stir fry with a LOT more vegetables and way less meat. I can't really switch altogether from white rice, though.

[Formosa Neijia]

Well that's how I've pretty much done things all my life but I'm noticing things now.

I'm eating only between 12-8 so when I wake up it's nothing but coffee till noon. If I go to push hands at 10, or meet up with somebody to work on something else before noon, then I wind up gassing out easier. Particularly in the summer heat lately.

I mean I know I need to HTFU. But do I have to be so hungry?

https://leangains.com/category/nutrition/
The guy that started IF is Martin Berkhan and he is using carb manipulation to get his great results. He used to hide thatback in the day when IF got big but in his recent book, he spelled it out a little better. It's important to know that he's manipulating carbs to get his results because a lot of people bought into the idea they could eat whatever they wanted in that 8 hour feeding window and still lose weight. When people figured out that wasn't the case, the carb manipulation made more sense.
At the end of your 8 hour feeding window, you should be loading carbs for peaceful sleep and to feel energetic the next morning. Get your protein and fat earlier, around 6pm. Be aware that total calories will still count, as Berkhan laid out in his book, or your fat loss will really stall. Good luck to you.

[Greg J]

Hey Origami,

Good to hear from you, brother. You've gotten some good feedback already, I'll just add my .3 cents.

When I was in my early twenties and training Muay Thai, I asked my teacher (a Thai in his forties who could still go the distance and put a serious hurt on anyone in the gym) about his diet. He said "you can eat anything as long as you train hard enough."

What this meant to me was that I needed to be flexible enough to let my training dictate what / when I ate. I think this is going to look a bit different for everyone. But here's what it looks like for me.

In the morning, if I am doing a steady state type of workout (usually running) then I don't worry about eating. Of course, my runs are almost always less than 5 miles. But if I'm getting together to train with someone in the morning where we will be working power shots to a shield and sparring (so a mix of aerobic and anaerobic), then I will drink a protein shake (homemade) about halfway through the workout. It's light enough to not cause me to bloat or cramp, and gives me the energy and protein I need to power through the workout and not feel gassed afterwards.

As for afternoon workouts, I just play it by ear but generally it's the same principle.

I will say that for weight loss/ health overall, I definitely recommend eliminating soda and processed foods as much as possible and moderating or eliminating alcohol. I know this is a bit contrary to what my Muay Thai teacher said, but it's what has worked for me.

Take care,
Greg