Qigong in circle walking?

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Qigong in circle walking?

Postby D_Glenn on Thu Nov 07, 2019 7:50 am

Another thing you can work on is finding the control over your Transverse Abdominal Muscles (TVA), and then learn to isolate the contraction of them from your other Abdominal muscles. The TVA are the innermost layer and you want to learn to contract only the half of the TVA that is on the inside of the circle, while the other side is relaxed. This is what Turning your Waist towards the center means. This contraction can be held the whole time you’re turning in that direction, then switch and hold the opposite side. These muscles can be trained to contract for a long time because of their close proximity to the liver. Unlike skeletal muscle that can really only last for 6 minutes.


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Re: Qigong in circle walking?

Postby marvin8 on Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:28 am

D_Glenn wrote:Another thing you can work on is finding the control over your Transverse Abdominal Muscles (TVA), and then learn to isolate the contraction of them from your other Abdominal muscles. The TVA are the innermost layer and you want to learn to contract only the half of the TVA that is on the inside of the circle, while the other side is relaxed. This is what Turning your Waist towards the center means. This contraction can be held the whole time you’re turning in that direction, then switch and hold the opposite side. These muscles can be trained to contract for a long time because of their close proximity to the liver. Unlike skeletal muscle that can really only last for 6 minutes.

Some exercises to develop a stronger TVA.

Excerpt from "The Transverse Abdominis – The Spanx Of Your Abdominal Muscles:"
Jennifer M. Regan on June 02, 2009 wrote:How Do You Get A Stronger Transverse Abdominis?

If you dread or despise crunches, you are in luck! To develop and strengthen the transverse abdominis, you do not have to perform flexion or extension exercises. To start building strength in your TVA muscle, you will need to know how to activate it through a series of “draw-in” abdominal maneuvers. “Drawing in your abdominal muscles” is a conscious process and takes a lot of practice, but once you understand it, you will see results like a stronger core, flatter stomach and a beach ready tummy.

Draw In Your Abs

For many people, learning to draw in the abdominals is a difficult process. As mentioned above, most people are used to working their core by developing the rectus abdominis muscles through conventional methods such as crunches, sit-ups, and other flexion/extension exercises. Remember, these exercises push out the abdominal wall. We want to pull the abdominal wall in. The concept of drawing in is the exact opposite of rectus abdominis training. It is the process where you pull IN your abdominal wall.

Five Exercises That Focus On Drawing In The Abdominal Muscles Include:
1. The lying draw-in maneuver (tummy vacs)
2. Foot-hand bear crawl
3. The forward ball roll
4. Hollow body holds
5. Planks


Excerpt from RSF thread "What is Jin 勁? — Scott P. Phillips:"
marvin8 wrote:Scott said "continuous connection," not continuous movement. Don’t use jin use continuous connection. How do you get continuous connection? You get it using four words Xukong Lingtong. We are only going to talk about xu right now, "hollow body” (aka empty body). Xu: empty like a puppet, "dead weight" body, but it is also radiant and luminous. “Hollow body” exercise cultivates maximum gravity, etc.

Hollow body (e.g., NoSword in RSF discussion) is an concept/exercise used by acrobats, gymnasts and aerial artists. Here a Ciruqe du Soleil acrobat does a hollow body exercise. (At 3:30, the acrobat says a celebrity surgeon said you'll never have back problems [e.g., johnwang's hunchback thread], if you do the exercise well):


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b1K0BdjnNks&t=3m30s


Excerpt from "Dustin Poirier’s Coach Expects Fourth-Round Finish Of Khabib Nurmagomedov:"
Jon Fuentes on Sep 1, 2019 wrote:“The goal really is to make sure we’re digging for underhooks and that Dustin has a strong core so he can rotate, as far as the transverse abdominis for rotation, so he can change direction and turn Khabib around and have him facing the cage,” Daru explained. “Then [Poirier] can push off and rain his shots the way he does.”
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Re: Qigong in circle walking?

Postby wiesiek on Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:13 am

Thank you Marvin, nice clip,
however
I`m not quite sure, if set presented there will develop the same "circle walkin`" qualities; specially for Bagua needs.
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Re: Qigong in circle walking?

Postby wiesiek on Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:33 am

@D_Gleen
I would ask you:
Why positions order is significantly different in "sub" Bagua styles? (not to mention different names and hands positioning).
In Li Zi Mings system, presented in Tom B. Book starting position is "Downward Sinking Palm", which I know as the _ "Bear", from Lu Shu Tien`s system. Your advise is - start from the maxi Yang -"Lion", in mentioned Lu`s system - "Dragon" begins.

Tom explained, that:
...Downward SP" is the first palm, `cause it particularly stimulates and opens Du and Ren meridians . When these channels are activated, is easier open the others..."
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Re: Qigong in circle walking?

Postby D_Glenn on Sun Dec 01, 2019 4:29 pm

Downard Sinking is more a health posture to, in my lineage, lower high blood pressure.

Yang postures: Lion, when done with correct palm shape, should build up more muscle mass in your upper body. This promotes more blood flow and as muscles grow the fascia surrounding them also grows. Our bear/ YinYang Fish Palm, will build the muscles of your back. Dragon can build up the ribcage and chest.

Yin postures will cause your muscles to become lean but long. You want to do the Yang Postures first because they expand the fascia and heals it up. Then when you do the Yin postures you know you are lengthening and stretching healthy fascia.

Worry about blood flow in Martial Circle Turning, not qi flow. Where there’s blood, qi has to also be there.

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Re: Qigong in circle walking?

Postby everything on Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:09 pm

Aside from the opening of meridians (very interested in this) and muscle contraction (lower interest here but some), how about emphasis on gentle stretching and lengthening + (p)rehab through the slow or fast movements? I guess the non-MA monks would've worked on that on purpose or as a side effect? Instead of doing, say, a very "linear" downward dog. What do we still know about that (non-MA emphasis) these days? Getting more into the MA side of things, that leads into the "spiraling" power building aspects quite naturally I suppose.
Last edited by everything on Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Qigong in circle walking?

Postby yeniseri on Fri Dec 06, 2019 12:13 am

Looks simple enough!
You have the equivalent of chanssujin (silk reeling) within circle walking and the elements of expansion, contraction, opening and closing in a horizonla/vertical positions with bending of knees 'forcing the musculature to operate to maximum efficiency meaning calf muscle 'invigoration' with elements of stomach and heart involvement per the exercising of muscle in various parts of the body. Jingluo (meridians) are 'strengthened", body fat is used as fuel in the maintenance of musculoskeletal integrity. Don't blame the Qi ;D
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