Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

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Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby johnwang on Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:30 pm

Why some CMA systems don't have this kind of training?

Your thought?



Last edited by johnwang on Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
I'm still allergy to "push".
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby edededed on Sun Aug 11, 2019 6:47 am

Seems like good training to add if it is not there already.

I think many arts have some kind of partner training (learning to block/parry, etc.).

Taiji I think may spend a lot of time in tuishou; maybe there is some step after that that to learn how to actually make contact.
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby Bhassler on Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:33 am

The second clip was much better than the first. The drums and speed make the first one seem exciting, but they're out of range for their techniques, and as a result a lot of the defensive moves don't come until after the striking limb is at full extension. If they were in range they would have been hit already. It's also very easy to just kind of swing your arms out quickly with no body mechanics in that kind of fast drill with no consequences, as there's no real feedback in terms of effectiveness. As Marc MacYoung says, intensity does not equal reality.
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby Drake on Mon Aug 12, 2019 7:13 am

Every system has 2 man. It's a matter of utilization. Either it's passed down, or not is up to the temperament/skill, or lack thereof of the instructor(s)/student(s), or not. <<shrug>> Sometimes it just has to do with insurance that there are no hard feelings, etc.. in the school.
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby suckinlhbf on Mon Aug 12, 2019 7:50 am

Every system has 2 man

Dude - stranger. Our system can only be learnt and trained by "hand talk". If not, it is fake.
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby windwalker on Mon Aug 12, 2019 1:05 pm

As to the question.

Depends largely on a students focus and that of the teacher..

Hard to learn what a teacher doesn't teach. Hard to teach what a student doesn't want to learn.


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traditional training practiced live

starting 3:30


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ze8esJfyzug


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dA5-Q6wALTg
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby johnwang on Fri Aug 16, 2019 2:24 pm

Does Taiji system have this kind of training?

I'm still allergy to "push".
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby oragami_itto on Fri Aug 16, 2019 3:29 pm

Sure, that's the idea behind push hands patterns and da lu
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby edededed on Sat Aug 17, 2019 7:29 pm

Taiji seems to have a practice called "lancaihua" that is a method of sanshou, and may look similar to this (well, like between this and tuishou).
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby Bao on Sat Aug 17, 2019 11:42 pm

johnwang wrote:Does Taiji system have this kind of training?



Yes. There are striking & defense drills. Few schools practice it though. And with full speed even fewer. Seems to be most common in older Wu (both) and Yang Schools. It should obviously be done without compromising and Tai Chi principles as balance, structure and song.

IMO this type of practice is rather important in Tai Chi as it can give the practitioner confidence to use his art. How else could you know that you could stay balanced and relaxed without tensing up while someone launches punches at you?
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby johnwang on Sun Aug 18, 2019 12:46 am

Bao wrote: Few schools practice it though.

My long fist class doesn't have this kind of training. This is why I have designed

- rhino guard,
- double spears,
- octopus,
- separate hands,
- …

training for my students. IMO, to be able to deal with incoming punches can be the most important training in all MA system.

Last edited by johnwang on Sun Aug 18, 2019 12:49 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby Bao on Sun Aug 18, 2019 11:10 am

Do you like this? “Tai Chi Boxing” drill from William Chen. More on the same channel.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=5k0SOI7ETX0

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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby johnwang on Sun Aug 18, 2019 12:49 pm

Why everything is in slow speed?

I'm still allergy to "push".
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby Bao on Sun Aug 18, 2019 10:29 pm

Why all so slow? My thought exactly.

I believe that he is trying to get William Chen’s mechanics correct, using the kua and opening of the lower ribs to generate punching strength. His method is very detailed. But as presented here maybe a too conservative approach, gets stiff. Would be good to see this guy loosen up a bit.
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Re: Why some CMA systems don't have this training?

Postby johnwang on Mon Aug 19, 2019 1:34 pm

Bao wrote:I believe that he is trying to get William Chen’s mechanics correct, ...

If you can only have correct mechanics when you do slow movement, there is something wrong in your training.
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