Internal punch

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Internal punch

Postby wingchun on Sat Nov 09, 2019 2:35 pm

Can someone please explain what's going on here in regards to bio-mechanics and intent to be able to generate this kind of power?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QkXSsHdGFkI
Last edited by wingchun on Sat Nov 09, 2019 2:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Internal punch

Postby denchen on Sat Nov 09, 2019 3:03 pm

Looks compliant, the uke is standing square on - easily unbalanced and drops like a stone.
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Re: Internal punch

Postby johnwang on Sat Nov 09, 2019 3:09 pm

Image
I'm still allergic to "push".
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Re: Internal punch

Postby oragami_itto on Sat Nov 09, 2019 3:45 pm

Why are they holding phone books against their chest instead of pads at a rational distance from the body?
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Re: Internal punch

Postby Taste of Death on Sat Nov 09, 2019 9:18 pm

They hit you, you're dead. One blow you die.


Is he talking about his opponent or the names in the phone book?
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Re: Internal punch

Postby charles on Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:02 am

...
Last edited by charles on Tue Nov 12, 2019 11:26 am, edited 9 times in total.
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Re: Internal punch

Postby Bhassler on Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:18 am

I think he's doing it more with a hip hinge and weight shift-- likely a subtle weight drop as well.

Phone books are nice because they give good feedback to the giver and receiver about where the force is actually going. To do anything on a big squishy pad your 0 inch punch would effectively have to be a 2 inch punch. Plus, phone books used to be cheap (free) and plentiful.

What he's doing is not particularly difficult, nor is it necessarily tied to any sort of esoteric "internal" body method. He's good at what he does. I would recommend not letting him hit you, if at all possible.
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Re: Internal punch

Postby MaartenSFS on Sun Nov 10, 2019 10:52 am

We call this Zhenjin, or shocking power. It's not that hard to learn but requires a fair bit of training. It probably took me six months of daily training to be able to use it in sparring and three years to get really good at it, by which point it was scary effective and people stopped sparring with me.. :P

Mind you, I was training a lot of other things too, so it could be done quicker. The power comes from rapidly dropping your centre of gravity whilst issuing some power into the ground, then, when, the ground sends back an equal force, re-directing that force into your opponent in the form of a wave.

The great thing about it is that it doesn't rely on acceleration, will do a similar amount of damage no matter where your fist is in the punching process, can be done whilst moving backwards and forwards, has great stopping power and can be used with or without a weapon.

Note: You will still need to be able to make contact with them for it to be of any use. 8-)
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Re: Internal punch

Postby wayne hansen on Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:30 am

I was taught to do this very early in my training with both punch and press
It doesn't take much skill
I stopped doing it because I was hurting people
The phone book magnifies the hit if anything
It certainly doesn't soften it at all
Don't put power into the form let it naturally arise from the form
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Re: Internal punch

Postby Trick on Mon Nov 11, 2019 12:51 am

Doesn’t interrogation officers use phone books, supposedly gives no mark but still delivers the pain ?........I’ve seen that in the movies anyway 8-)


Ripping a phone book in half is also an impressive skill 8-)
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Re: Internal punch

Postby wayne hansen on Mon Nov 11, 2019 1:19 am

Yeah but they lean back and snap it against your ear
They don't hold it there and hit thru it
Don't put power into the form let it naturally arise from the form
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Re: Internal punch

Postby Dmitri on Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:12 am

"if they don't go down, then you don't have the real internal", is that what he actually said at the end there? :D
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Re: Internal punch

Postby GrahamB on Mon Nov 11, 2019 9:47 am

This video reminds me of the early 2000s. Sniff.
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Re: Internal punch

Postby Bao on Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:01 am

I remember this video from when it was published, but didn't find it later. Thought it was gone.

The technique is legit IME, but what I don't really appreciate is this "now I only use 30%... " talk. How did he measure the percentage if it's too dangerous to go 100%? :/ It might look very impressive, but often when you see vids like this and similar demonstrations, what you see is what you get. There's no reason to speculate about what someone possibly "could" do.
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Re: Internal punch

Postby marvin8 on Mon Nov 11, 2019 5:13 pm

Here are video clips of James Demile (Bruce Lee's student) performing a three and one inch punch. Per Demile, the one inch punch (lead right hand/foot) Bruce performed in demonstrations was a push punch, not for combat. Demile recommends to use the rear hand for combat to drop the opponent on the spot.

In the following video clip Demile demonstrates the three inch punch (for combat) with left foot forward and right rear hand. It appears Demile's weight is on the back foot (rear hip) at the time of impact?

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Dec 13, 2013

Highlights from my DVD Advanced Aikijujutsu. This clip featuring James DeMile teaching the Bruce Lee 'power punch'. Complete DVD available at http://www.amazon.com:
Image
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBVV0ImGVfs&t=6m24s

Slow motion:
Image

In the following video clip, Demile appears to have his weight on the back foot at impact?

jimstyro
Jan 18, 2008

DeMille sends three guys sprawling with a one-inch punch (full impact muffled by a couple of phone books):

Image
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8aRkYaJ3Vd8
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