Stop going for the big push!!

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby johnwang on Fri Jul 23, 2021 5:53 pm

Are there any video that a student pushes his teacher and make his teacher to fly away?
I'm still allergic to "push".
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby Taste of Death on Fri Jul 23, 2021 7:15 pm

johnwang wrote:Are there any video that a student pushes his teacher and make his teacher to fly away?


In Han Shi Yi Quan we emphasize springy arms. The arms act like bumpers but it is the spine is what we hit them with and it is all propelled by the movement of the legs. If Sam Tam stepped between the other guy's legs and kept moving as far as he could step the passive guy would have flown back further and more forcefully. Like Wayne said, it's just a demo. Almost all Han Jing Chen students can do this. It's different than what Sam is doing.

My style of yiquan does not consider a push to be a push. We don't push with the arms. It's the legs that carry the power.

Once you have control of your opponent's equilibrium you can make him go anywhere, including flying. The push is fairly low level. John, I live in Los Angeles. I can teach you to make people fly threw the air in no time.
Last edited by Taste of Death on Fri Jul 23, 2021 8:37 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby Taste of Death on Fri Jul 23, 2021 7:20 pm

Some of this and some of that. And some "pushing".

https://youtu.be/HF2jzg46DdI
Last edited by Taste of Death on Fri Jul 23, 2021 7:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby Steve James on Sat Jul 24, 2021 5:26 am

If Sam Tam stepped between the other guy's legs and kept moving


Distance (position) determines everything when it comes to application of anything. It will change the entire nature of a movement --from a form, for ex.. I would visualize it as a matter of relative center/lines. I'd argue that BKTS could be a strike, "push," push down, or throw --depending...
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby Doc Stier on Sat Jul 24, 2021 6:08 am

Taste of Death wrote:Once you have control of your opponent's equilibrium you can make him go anywhere, including flying.

Agreed. That was the point of my previous post on this thread. :)
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby GrahamB on Sat Jul 24, 2021 8:28 am

Franky, there are times when only a big push will do....

Image

Now, what was the question again?
I could be wrong.
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby taichiseeker on Mon Aug 30, 2021 8:36 am

this video really helped me to understand ahn (push) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eClIWUUocpI
Last edited by taichiseeker on Mon Aug 30, 2021 8:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby oragami_itto on Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:01 am

taichiseeker wrote:this video really helped me to understand ahn (push) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eClIWUUocpI


Are you affiliated with Sifu Hairston?
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby taichiseeker on Mon Aug 30, 2021 11:48 am

Are you affiliated with Sifu Hairston?


no, i wish.

however, i believe hairston is one of a few modern/contemporary practitioners and teachers of tai chi that ive seen that really has both the knowledge and experience in application that is necessary for someone to call themselves a "master". i have been to many seminars and paid lots of money, and i can honestly say none of the people i paid for these workshops had anywhere close to the ability to actually use tai chi as hairston

in the situation of "the big push" i believe the biggest problem with going for a big push is that you are committed and easily countered if your opponent is skilled enough / anticipates your push. this video is so clear in how it shows that your arms should be relaxed and not committed to the push, even as your lower body does commit to the push and establishes a solid position close to / underneath your opponent.

wonderfully explained and demonstrated. i have worked on this with several practice partners and it has been very very good for my push hands
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby C.J.W. on Sun Sep 05, 2021 6:05 am

In my Bagua and Xingyi lineage, there isn't a clear distinction between a push and a hit.

When we strike the opponent, the quality of the strike itself always falls somewhere on a spectrum between the two extremes. My teacher refers to this type of strike as having the quality of "pushing within hitting and hitting within pushing." The pushing force compromises the opponent's structure while the hitting force causes damage.

IMO, it is a characteristic of IMA striking.
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Re: Stop going for the big push!!

Postby wayne hansen on Sun Sep 05, 2021 5:49 pm

I agree
The mechanics of a strike is trained in the push
All that differs is the speed of delivery
Don't put power into the form let it naturally arise from the form
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