Student-teacher ceremonies

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Student-teacher ceremonies

Postby origami_itto on Thu Mar 24, 2022 11:36 am

So I'm familiar with the baishi ceremony where a student becomes an inner door disciple but are there any other steps leading up to that, traditionally?

Is there a formal acceptance as a student before the baishi? Are there other ceremonies afterward to recognize progress and achievement?
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Re: Student-teacher ceremonies

Postby Appledog on Thu Mar 24, 2022 7:51 pm

origami_itto wrote:So I'm familiar with the baishi ceremony where a student becomes an inner door disciple but are there any other steps leading up to that, traditionally?

Is there a formal acceptance as a student before the baishi? Are there other ceremonies afterward to recognize progress and achievement?


As far as I am aware, it has more to do with if you want to be a disciple than your actual skill level. Because you are taking on the responsibility to pass it on. Not just learn it for yourself. Otherwise the certification is meaningless as you can learn pretty much everything without being a disciple. Some teachers will test you first, depending on the social circumstances and if they like you or whatever. I find the whole thing to be nonstandard. I've been offered lineage in various styles upon first meeting a teacher, and I've had to ask teachers I've known for 30 years for it. It's different based on the teacher I think.

If it's something you are after, mainly it has to do with whether the teacher likes you and if you can actually take on the responsibility I.E. does your wife agree with you doing martial arts, do you have a lot of work or debt that you cant really focus on martial arts, do you have the physical capability, are you the right age, did you pass all the little tests, etc.

Anyone have any experience with becoming a disciple could probably say more :)
Last edited by Appledog on Thu Mar 24, 2022 7:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Student-teacher ceremonies

Postby wayne hansen on Thu Mar 24, 2022 10:10 pm

I know of teachers who took on 1 or 2 disciples their whole life and dozens in their last years
A lot to do with taking care of their family some disciples having less than a years training
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Re: Student-teacher ceremonies

Postby MiaoZhen on Thu Mar 31, 2022 11:46 am

I am not aware of any other formal ceremony aside from a Bai Shi (I've taken Bai Shi in our school, and that's all there is really). In TCMA there was no rank system so to speak, and that's one of the things I find refreshing about it having come from modern Japanese budo originally. And the Bai Shi ceremony is very personal to each teacher. Sometimes it is based on skill, other times on political or family connections, other times on money, etc...

This is quite different for example in some Japanese Koryu Bujutsu where there is some sort of skill/rank recognition in the form of traditional licenses. These predate the modern belt ranking system. The system of licenses is still used in Koryu systems, but even those will vary from Ryu-ha to Ryu-ha. The idea of ranks of any sort related to martial arts seemed to have originated in Japan - I've not seen it in traditional Chinese systems.

origami_itto wrote:So I'm familiar with the baishi ceremony where a student becomes an inner door disciple but are there any other steps leading up to that, traditionally?

Is there a formal acceptance as a student before the baishi? Are there other ceremonies afterward to recognize progress and achievement?
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Re: Student-teacher ceremonies

Postby wushutiger on Fri Apr 01, 2022 7:46 pm

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Re: Student-teacher ceremonies

Postby Doc Stier on Fri Apr 01, 2022 8:16 pm

Very nice! Thanks for sharing, brother Byron. 8-)
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Re: Student-teacher ceremonies

Postby wushutiger on Sun Apr 03, 2022 11:39 pm

Very nice! Thanks for sharing, brother Byron. 8-)


Glad you liked it!
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