Your kung fu is bullshit

[edededed]

Don't and you wind up with nothing IMO. Fun? I have my XBox for that.

To me sparring/wrestlng is fun. I have paid strengers $20 per hour if they are willing to spar/wrestle with me. To them, they can make some money. To me, I can have some fun.

Are some strangers worth maybe only $5 or $10/hour to wrestle with? Maybe there is a pricing tier...

[Giles]

Or to spell it out: Training something like tai chi as a ‘life art’, because it does you good on all sorts of levels and is interesting and fun, does NOT automatically mean that you lose the focus on martial/self-defence aspects and you can’t fight your way out of a paper bag.

This is stating the obvious. But maybe it needs to be stated.

Peace.

[origami_itto]

I mean, test your art occasionally so you know that it still works, keep training to stay strong and limber, meditate for mind and spirit.

I honestly don't need or want high intensity fight situations in my life too frequently. There's no need to obsessively spar. For the 2% of potential troublemakers that I think could give me problems at this point I've got two pit bulls and weapons everywhere at home.

The art isn't complete without both the martial and the civil. I would actually go so far as to say that you cannot fully express the benefits of either without fully embracing and cultivating both.

[GrahamB]

Hello all,

To refer back to the spirit of original post, for a moment, the problem of being deeply invested in a self-image of ‘profound martial mastery’, is that it’s a huge obstacle to many things. And I think it makes you an asshole sometimes. And yes, I’m an asshole, too.

Firstly, you constantly have to defend that image (I give you this thread as an example).

Secondly, you have to be having some sort of constant self dialogue ‘Am I actually deadly?’ Which is a huge waste of mental energy. And if you say you’re not having this dialogue, then I simply don’t believe you. Again, I think this thread provides a good example.

I think if you just adopt an attitude of “I’m just going to train this stuff and I don’t care if people think I’m deadly” you’ll just be happier and you might actually become pretty good at martial arts.

There’s that old saying “invest in loss” and there’s also the Lao Tzu writing on a similar subject:

“The master stays behind
That is why she is ahead,
She is detached from all things,
That is why she is one with them,
Because she has let go of herself,
She is perfectly fulfilled.”

Or as Alan’s Morissette said, most notably in her 1998 treatise on life, “Thank U”, a work to which I feel we must all refer to from time to time:

“The moment I let go of it was the moment
I got more than I could handle
The moment I jumped off of it
Was the moment I touched down”

So, thank U India, and thank U Rum Soaked Fist.

[Quigga]

I'm your Venus, I'm your fire, your desire

Can't live without an self image - no self = no functional personality -> see people with highly progressed dementia

Letting go of accumulated BS, yes
Changing one's self, yes
Losing it permanently - only during biological death, the Soul lives on

Deadly Dead Lee

Changing is the goal

No animal is always hunting or always resting

Training resting aspects when one is in hunting mode is hard and vice versa

Always looking for food, always needy for something would make quite a pissed of and exhausted kitty Kat

Be smart about change

WW

Thank you Lots of possibilities

[D_Glenn]

Alanis Morissette.

The only thing ironic about her song “Ironic” is that it’s written by someone who has no idea what irony means.

.

[Quigga]

I don't get it

Ebony and ivory

May have a touch of autism

Pick your choice or choose your pick

Like a cryptominer would

[origami_itto]

Alanis Morissette.

The only thing ironic about her song “Ironic” is that it’s written by someone who has no idea what irony means.

.

'I mean.. maybe she's jiust BEING ironic...

[Formosa Neijia]

To refer back to the spirit of original post, for a moment, the problem of being deeply invested in a self-image of ‘profound martial mastery’, is that it’s a huge obstacle to many things. And I think it makes you an asshole sometimes. And yes, I’m an asshole, too.

Firstly, you constantly have to defend that image (I give you this thread as an example).

Secondly, you have to be having some sort of constant self dialogue ‘Am I actually deadly?’ Which is a huge waste of mental energy. And if you say you’re not having this dialogue, then I simply don’t believe you. Again, I think this thread provides a good example.

With respect, this isn't at all what training for fighting effectiveness is like. There's been talk of false dichotomy in the thread but I not only haven't seen a positive example of practicing for martial effectiveness raised, I'm seeing the very idea denigrated. Ed and I had some positive exchanges back in the day so even though I disagreed with his posts on this, he did at least put in that if you were doing the things he mentioned that you were "cool" so he's saying it's all good. But the responses to this don't show that.

Basically in this thread if you train for martial effectiveness then you're seen as some kind of loser/poser with extreme mental issues. If I asked for a positive example of a guy training for fighting effectiveness, I'd likely be given a comic book or movie character instead of a real person. If someone can't find a personal positive example of a guy that trains for fighting effectiveness then that tells me a lot about who your teachers are and who you surround yourself with.

[origami_itto]

To refer back to the spirit of original post, for a moment, the problem of being deeply invested in a self-image of ‘profound martial mastery’, is that it’s a huge obstacle to many things. And I think it makes you an asshole sometimes. And yes, I’m an asshole, too.

Firstly, you constantly have to defend that image (I give you this thread as an example).

Secondly, you have to be having some sort of constant self dialogue ‘Am I actually deadly?’ Which is a huge waste of mental energy. And if you say you’re not having this dialogue, then I simply don’t believe you. Again, I think this thread provides a good example.

With respect, this isn't at all what training for fighting effectiveness is like. There's been talk of false dichotomy in the thread but I not only haven't seen a positive example of practicing for martial effectiveness raised, I'm seeing the very idea denigrated. Ed and I had some positive exchanges back in the day so even though I disagreed with his posts on this, he did at least put in that if you were doing the things he mentioned that you were "cool" so he's saying it's all good. But the responses to this don't show that.

Basically in this thread if you train for martial effectiveness then you're seen as some kind of loser/poser with extreme mental issues. If I asked for a positive example of a guy training for fighting effectiveness, I'd likely be given a comic book or movie character instead of a real person. If someone can't find a personal positive example of a guy that trains for fighting effectiveness then that tells me a lot about who your teachers are and who you surround yourself with.

I train to be a better person. YMMV.

[Formosa Neijia]

I train to be a better person. YMMV.

Notice those of us interested in improving our fighting skill are constantly cast as mentally ill losers with identity issues but people who never, EVER shut the hell up about how superior they are because they are on their super-self-important, totally self-absorbed quest for "being at one with the dao" or enlightenment, etc. never are told they have a "self-image to protect" nor is mentioned the extreme mental energy defending that self-righteousness.

[Quigga]

Sure sounds defensive to me

[origami_itto]

I train to be a better person. YMMV.

Notice those of us interested in improving our fighting skill are constantly cast as mentally ill losers with identity issues but people who never, EVER shut the hell up about how superior they are because they are on their super-self-important, totally self-absorbed quest for "being at one with the dao" or enlightenment, etc. never are told they have a "self-image to protect" nor is mentioned the extreme mental energy defending that self-righteousness.

Dude, who cares what people think of you? Honestly. "So and so said mean things about me" .... wtf are you 12?

Nobody said any of that shit, that's just your projected insecurity. That's just bullshit getting in the way of you and quality communication.

It's great that you train hard, man, more power to you. I don't find much value in it for my life. I'd rather spend that time with my kids or working on something else. I've fought enough, won enough, lost enough, the only battle I really need to worry about is the one in my own head against that asshole that wants me to lay around smoking weed and watching cartoons all day. The rest of you phantoms simply don't matter.

Lighten up, man. Maybe try smoking some weed and watching cartoons. Get laid or something.

I've found that my own training has led me to find less justification and motivation for throwing insults and explaining myself. Not that I'm perfect, mind you, just that I'm not driven by this apparent need to prove I'm harder or smarter or better than anybody.

I'm just this Dad that likes Taijiquan, man, and I find it helps me be a better person. Ain't got a damn thing to do with you.

[Doc Stier]

When I began practicing martial arts in January of 1961, NOBODY trained primarily for physical fitness and health exercise benefits or primarily for personal self-cultivation benefits. Virtually EVERYONE trained for self-defense fighting skills.

Other benefits were onsidered to be auxiliary by-products of good instruction from a competent teacher coupled with a serious training regimen over time. That norm gradually changed with the advent of martial arts tournaments, shifting the focus away from effective fighting skills to winning trophies and medals in tournament forms and sparring competitions.

There were several instances in which I realized that I was going to lose tournament sparring matches on points to guys I believed I could defeat in a real street fight, so I decided to go ahead and just knock them out. Of course, I would then be disqualified, but at least there was some satisfaction in losing nonetheless.

Since the judging was most often so unrealistic and so unfair, I stopped entering all tournament competitions in 1975, and simply walked away from all the BS for good.

[origami_itto]

So is that still your primary focus? Who you lookin to fight?

Seriously, how often do you find it necessary to go full out with MMA jocks to make sure you still got the goods or be ready 'just in case"?