the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

Interested but can't see it
is there another way to see it besides Facebook?
Can you give a summary?

Here's the article the FB link is pointing to: https://express.adobe.com/page/qKGuEfHPWwGNv/?fbclid=IwAR3u5mMkqXghkAHmU--X2hZXG8Je_ilcvKT_F6hmB3c67pUuXX-Yqzs6Mmw

V nice article by Dan Docherty's senior kungfu brother Ian Cameron, who also studied the Wu 24 neigong directly under Cheng Tin-hung.

Thank you for the link!

Hi,

Thanks for the article - a good read. I really liked two points he made - firstly that older style training was to be shown a move a few times, then just get on and practice it, and people really didn't fuss too much about the exact angle of arms and legs, etc. If your form looked different to others, it wasn't a big deal - it was expected. The forms was yours to own. Compare this to various 'forms seminars' that get taught these days, with the seemingly endless 'individual correction'. It's a completely different mindset.

Secondly, the idea that change comes from within. That's related to the first point. If the change genuinely comes from within the student then the form is correct, the opposite being trying to fix a form by working from the outside.

A couple more things he mentioned that I'm not entirely sold on. Firstly, this idea that all that's required is practice and we should stop over intellectualising things. I think that's true to a point, but it's also why 90% (98?) of the people in a class never 'get it' and just keep going rounding circles for years never getting anywhere. I think being able to ask more "how" and "why" questions can lead to better understandings. I think the traditional Chinese teaching model can be improved in this area.

Secondly, he never really explains what he means by these dark forces " imposing ideas upon Tai Chi,", thus it seems a bit of a straw man argument to me. Who are these people? What exactly are they doing? He clearly has people in mind when he's writing, but it's left vague. Be specific, show your work.

Nice pictures!

I'm totally in agreement with the advice to think less and feel more, both in solo forms training and in practical applications for realtime fighting, as well as the concept of all meaningful change emanating from within.

Additionally, it has been my personal experience that much of the most valuable information I have received from my primary teachers was the direct result of constantly asking good questions regarding the energy dynamics of internal cultivation, beyond the superficial aspects of the external physical details of practice. ymmv.

There's a qualitative difference between change that "comes from within" in an environment of constant sparring, drilling, and other partner work with guys who have real life experience of what they're training for, and that which "comes from within" based on reading translations of poetry written by old dead guys and other philosophical musings.

I think you missed the point that school does plenty of fighting

wayne hansen wrote:I think you missed the point that school does plenty of fighting

Yes, I got that. What I was saying is that none of the other stuff works if that basis in functional violence isn't there. You don't have to over-correct a movement someone is going to immediately use to stop themselves getting punched in the face because physics and pain take care of that correction all on their own.

Given that Tai Chi naturally changes over the years, I still think it is important to stay as close to the original as possible.

But then again, what is the original Tai Chi, or closest to it? What your teacher does? Chen Xiaowang? "Imperial Yang"?

If you accept Tai Chi Chuan basically as a set of principles that unites all Tai Chi styles, then (IMHO) understanding and practicing those principles is what is important and everything else secondary. If those principles are present, there is Tai Chi Chuan. If they are not, there's no Tai Chi Chuan...

There are the principles as layed down in the classics
Then there is the Shen Fa of each school
Then there are the principles of the Shen Fa