Back Leg

[johnwang]

I don't know that the particular application is a part of the regular taijiquan curriculum/form.

When your opponent bears hug you from behind and tries to drag you down to the ground, your opponent is in a horse stance at that moment. If you can spring one of his legs back into a bow-arrow stance, he won't be able to drag you down. IMO, the leg spring is a good anti-takedown skill against a backward drag down no matter which style that you may train.

The question is, if "leg spring" is not in your Taiji, but since it's a such useful anti-takedown skill, what will you do?

- Cross training, or
- Bring "leg spring" into your Taiji?

[origami_itto]

I don't know that the particular application is a part of the regular taijiquan curriculum/form.

When your opponent bears hug you from behind and tries to drag you down to the ground, your opponent is in a horse stance at that moment. If you can spring one of his legs back into a bow-arrow stance, he won't be able to drag you down. IMO, the leg spring is a good anti-takedown skill against a backward drag down no matter which style that you may train.

The question is, if "leg spring" is not in your Taiji, but since it's a such useful anti-takedown skill, what will you do?

- Cross training, or
- Bring "leg spring" into your Taiji?

- not stress about a bear hug from behind?
- rely on other anti-bear hug from behind tactics?

I've been in several fights, even been jumped and mugged, and have never run into the bear hug from behind scenario so I am willing to leave that as a blind spot in my repertoire.

You can't train everything, I'm sure you'll agree. you pick your toolset for your needs.

[Quigga]

Tai Chi didn't evolve from long fist. That's just silly.

If you have to completely straighten out a limb to reach, maybe you just need better positioning and foot work. In training the fascia, straightening the limbs is very important.

[johnwang]

have never run into the bear hug from behind ...

If you can use your right leg to spring your opponent's left leg, since your opponent's won't be able to put more weight on his left leg, he won''t be able to take you down.

[johnwang]

Tai Chi didn't evolve from long fist. That's just silly.

Long fist is the mother of all CMA systems.

[Quigga]

Cool movements. They're both way too stiff in the spine. To suggest that Long Fist is the origin style of ALL CMA is even sillier.

I respect that you're very fond of long fist. I also respect your accomplishments. But that's just not true, nor does it make any sense whatsoever.

In a country as big as China, no two different styles could have started to form at the same time with completely different origins?

A sequence or pattern of movements has nothing to do with Tai Chi. 'My secret movement is better and more deadly than everybody elses!' - ...

[johnwang]

In a country as big as China, no two different styles could have started to form at the same time with completely different origins?

Long fist is a general term for all CMA systems along the Yellow River.

[Quigga]

That's a cool map. There's lots of space where the river doesn't flow. Those spaces have come up with MAs too.

You're trying to change what you've said before now. That's okay.

[origami_itto]

Tai Chi didn't evolve from long fist. That's just silly.

The classics refer to learning each of the taijiquan postures individually then connecting them together in one long, flowing sequence known as chang chaun or "long fist".
Some people today say that there is a secret Yang family form that only they know that is the long fist form but I don't put much stock in that, personally.

[Quigga]

Who knows who translated those classics and what got lost in that. I very much doubt that's the 'long fist' Mr. Wang was talking about.

Those people claiming to know a secret form... Good for them, I guess? There are many ways to make yourself more important than you actually are. (Maybe I'm doing the same, lol)

Changquan shows up as a regular style when using my Google Fu.

You don't really need any forms imo, but they make for good selling, claiming exclusivity.

[Bob]

Difference between a static snapshot and dynamic movement of flow in the form. Palm strikes/punches, if utilized in your form, usually require a split second of straitening for the delivery of power i.e. fajin(g) expression and application. Transfer of power from ground up to palm/fist. I know some who don't believe in striking/punches/palm strikes in their form

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7_qQvyUz-o

Master Yang Jun / Senior Form Demonstration



Of course this is a "Senior Form Demonstration" LOL

Or the younger set -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rf0YvmuGXOw

Grandmaster Yang Jun, 5th generation lineage holder, performs Yang Family's Traditional Form.

[windwalker]

Difference between a static snapshot and dynamic movement of flow in the form. Palm strikes/punches, if utilized in your form, usually require a split second of straitening for the delivery of power i.e. fajin(g) expression and application. Transfer of power from ground up to palm/fist.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7_qQvyUz-o

Master Yang Jun / Senior Form Demonstration

]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k7_qQvyUz-o

Of course this is a "Senior Form Demonstration" LOL

Have met some of his grandfathers "Yang Zhenduo "students who where teachers at the time "
the emphases among them seemed very consistent, something I would attribute as being systemic to their curriculum.
Emphases on peng jin ...

None it worked for them when encountering something not based on this....

looking at the clip...it seems very "frame" dependent" using the frame directly to transmit force
in instead of being a conductor of it..

Big responsibility carrying on the families teaching...




Yang Zhenduo went to great lengths to diferentiate between the types of movement exemplified in the Cheng Manching and his father’s style; and he made it clear that he wanted to highlight essential requirements of his father’s style.

[Bob]

I rescind my bajiquan/pigua training bias perspective on the back leg LOL

[windwalker]

Stances

By way of specific examples, the Yang style front stance purposefully straightens the rear leg in opposition to the force used in the bent forward leg, which pushes back against the forward thrust of the rear leg.


In the Cheng style, the rear leg is bent so that the knee of the rear leg hangs in a direct line below that leg side’s shoulder.


Furthermore, the Cheng style does not allow a dynamic tension to exist between the forward and rear leg.

As a result, the Yang stance is much longer than the Cheng stance. Also, the Yang style advocates a forward incline of the upper body in the front stance. In the Cheng style the upper body is maintained in a straight up-and-down position, perpendicular to the floor.

In terms of the rear or back stance the Yang style allows 30 percent of the weight to remain on the front foot.

The Cheng style advocates the emptying of the weight or the forward leg and the complete transfer of all weight to the rear foot. T

[windwalker]

The examples are quite striking...

Emphasizing the carrying down of family traditions, and changes brought about by a different approach.

What is better depending on need and depth of understanding....

each having their own merit's...

Something I noted in transitioning from Tung, to CMC, to my teachers method

all very different...