Teacher Profile

Discussion on the three big Chinese internals, Yiquan, Bajiquan, Piguazhang and other similar styles.

Re: Teacher Profile

Postby origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 11:43 am

everything wrote:
TARDIS


just go to the claimed sources and wellsprings in that case. Don't stop with Yang Luchan or Dong Haichuan. Even check out the fairy tale guys who have been "proved".


I'm sure they'd love to gift their art to an American Gweilo from the future with no relevant trade.

Was just reading a post about a student with Parkinsons. They had to re-learn how to walk at 68. They were worried about the kicks and low basin work and Alex told them to not worry about it. Stick with the simplified form content basically.

Now at 73, they can do the kicks, low basin postures, and some weapons forms.

I don't know about anybody else, but the point of any martial art, for me, is to live a better life for longer. Maybe that's keeping somebody from hurting, maiming, or killing me, maybe that's keeping me from hurting, maiming, or killing myself. Maybe it's just cultivating the strength, balance, and confidence to navigate my life more competently. Not fall in the shower, be less susceptible to disease.
Last edited by origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 12:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby wayne hansen on Tue Dec 12, 2023 11:57 am

The Tardis would be of little use
The fact that u dont see past Mizner shows what you are learning now is not working
That is reinforced by your pushing vids
My writing style is just trying to convey thoughts that I am not close enough to show physically
I respond to what is written not for the writer but for those that might be seduced to go down the road that may lead to de evolution of the art I love
There is no need to heed anything I say
I am just trying to give a helping hand to those trying to find a better way
We don’t all have to eat macdonalds
However we do need to know it’s nutritional value or lack there of
I might change my name to the Tai Chi Troll
I don’t wish to offend but as in pushing
If pushed I yield only to return
Last edited by wayne hansen on Tue Dec 12, 2023 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 12:05 pm

wayne hansen wrote:The Tardis would be of little use
The fact that u dont see past Mizner shows what you are learning now is not working
That is reinforced by your pushing vids
My writing style is just trying to convey thoughts that I am not close enough to show physically
I respond to what is written not for the writer but for those that might be seduced to go down the road that may lead to de evolution of the art I love
There is no need to heed anything I say
I am just trying to give a helping hand to those trying to find a better way
We don’t all have to eat macdonalds
However we do need to know it’s nutritional value or lack there of
I might change my name to the Tai Chi Troll
I don’t wish to offend but as in pushing
If pushed I yield only to return


Hey man, for real. Thanks for your input.

I'm sure Alex would welcome your feedback, too. If you have suggestions for how he can improve his teaching, you're better of giving them to him directly.

My intent here is merely to inform others about the content of his curriculum. Not argue with miserable old codgers.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby wayne hansen on Tue Dec 12, 2023 12:37 pm

Your final line says it all
Don't put power into the form let it naturally arise from the form
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 12:52 pm

Thank you for your valuable contribution.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby Doc Stier on Tue Dec 12, 2023 1:34 pm

As always, we don't have to agree with anyone about anything in order to be courteous and respectful with one another. That said, we typically don't see the notable teachers with name fame, who are maliciously mocked or criticized on a regular basis online, ever post similarly rude and disrespectful comments about other martial artists. Very interesting. Ever wondered why that is?
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 1:52 pm

Doc Stier wrote:As always, we don't have to agree with anyone about anything in order to be courteous and respectful with one another. That said, we typically don't see the notable teachers with name fame, who are maliciously mocked or criticized on a regular basis online, ever make similarly rude and disrespectful comments about other martial artists. Ever wondered why that is? Hmmm! ???


I've been told I'll go far... because I have such a long way to go.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby ParadoxTeapot on Tue Dec 12, 2023 2:12 pm

Doc Stier wrote:As always, we don't have to agree with anyone about anything in order to be courteous and respectful with one another. That said, we typically don't see the notable teachers with name fame, who are maliciously mocked or criticized on a regular basis online, ever make similarly rude and disrespectful comments about other martial artists. Ever wondered why that is? Hmmm! ???


;) They do it behind closed doors. Behind the curtains. Hidden from the public.

If they are famous, they have a reputation and public image to care about. They have to be careful with what they say and by 'politically correct'.

But once they're given the luxury to speak their genuine thoughts and beliefs behind closed doors, there can be gossip.

What they say to the public and what they say privately are sometimes opposites.

There's a saying: "We have three faces. The first face, you show to the world. The second face, you show to your close friends and family. The third face, you never show anyone."
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 2:53 pm

Steve James wrote:I had a teacher who said not to put a hat on his head, because it will make someone want to knock it off.


You know I tried hard writing that to keep it straight forward and avoid any hint of hero worship or elevation. I really do admire the guy though so it's hard to keep it from coming through sometimes.

I'm pretty sure anybody that would put a target on his head already knows who he is. The family taught open-secretly during the cultural revolution and they command a great deal of respect in China and among the senior martial arts community in the US even today. That sort of politicking is way above my pay grade and I'm glad to stay as far as possible away from it. He gets people coming for him at workshops, etc. My goal here is to just to let folks know about the classes he's got available for new students and how they can get involved in the workshops or distance learning options. Full stop. Hopefully won't be too much of an embarrassment in the process.

I mean as far as I can tell, he's got nothing to prove, just out to teach cuz that's what his Dad told him he was going to do when he turned 5 and he grew up loving the art. People get so weird and precious about things. Crushing those poor pearls to powder in your grip.

I have shopped around a little in search of the right teacher and I firmly believe in his ability to help me improve. I have zero reservations about recommending the material or teacher to others.

I read Ashe's site while working on this, since he'd recently done a similar profile that was much more in depth and complimentary about him versus the curriculum.

He writes, about his own teacher something that mirrors my own experience. Though I've done a lot of learning from a poor teacher, me myself.

Ashe HIggs wrote:Remembering the Chinese proverb that “it is better to spend three years looking for a good teacher than to spend three years learning from a poor one,” he kept looking and hoping that “when the student was ready, the master would appear.”

...

Ashe became a distance student of Master Chin.

“The first few years were tough for sure. I didn’t see my Sifu often back then, but I just couldn’t give up on something so amazing.”

So i guess I first started learning from him in Spring of 2019, in person once or twice a year, every time picking up something better and better. It just makes sense to stick with it. I've never really grooved as well with any other teacher.

ParadoxTeapot wrote: ;) They do it behind closed doors. Behind the curtains. Hidden from the public.


Everybody talks a little shit now and then. I'm pushing 50 and trying to do less of it in public, personally. Around here though there's a couple folks that really know how to pull it out of me.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby Doc Stier on Tue Dec 12, 2023 4:02 pm

ParadoxTeapot wrote:
Doc Stier wrote:As always, we don't have to agree with anyone about anything in order to be courteous and respectful with one another. That said, we typically don't see the notable teachers with name fame, who are maliciously mocked or criticized on a regular basis online, ever make similarly rude and disrespectful comments about other martial artists. Ever wondered why that is? Hmmm! ???


;) They do it behind closed doors. Behind the curtains. Hidden from the public.

If they are famous, they have a reputation and public image to care about. They have to be careful with what they say and by 'politically correct'.

But once they're given the luxury to speak their genuine thoughts and beliefs behind closed doors, there can be gossip.

What they say to the public and what they say privately are sometimes opposites.

There's a saying: "We have three faces. The first face, you show to the world. The second face, you show to your close friends and family. The third face, you never show anyone."

That is exactly my point. The famous teachers are typically not disrespectful or insulting on public internet forums like this or in Facebook groups, and I don't believe the reason has anything to do with political correctness. ::)

Additionally, it is never two faced to say nothing at all. In fact, they should probably be given an award for remaining silent when there's so much that needs to be said. -shrug-
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 5:12 pm

Doc Stier wrote:That is exactly my point. The famous teachers are typically not disrespectful or insulting on public internet forums like this or in Facebook groups, and I don't believe the reason has anything to do with political correctness. ::)


I try hard not to say anything about someone or their work I wouldn't say to their face.

At times that has been a gross miscalculation, but I do my best.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby nicklinjm on Tue Dec 12, 2023 6:03 pm

Trying to get this thread back on-topic (although it may be too late), thanks for the write-up Origami. I get that you feel Alex has a great teaching methodology, that comes through clearly.

What is not so clear is how you feel his skills compare to other teachers / branches and what made you choose the current members of the Dong family. As you know, there are plenty of 'flavours' of Yang out there - Fu Zhongwen, CMC, Yang Zhenduo / Yang Jun, etc etc. What skills does Alex have that put him a cut above?
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby origami_itto on Tue Dec 12, 2023 7:05 pm

nicklinjm wrote:Trying to get this thread back on-topic (although it may be too late), thanks for the write-up Origami. I get that you feel Alex has a great teaching methodology, that comes through clearly.

What is not so clear is how you feel his skills compare to other teachers / branches and what made you choose the current members of the Dong family. As you know, there are plenty of 'flavours' of Yang out there - Fu Zhongwen, CMC, Yang Zhenduo / Yang Jun, etc etc. What skills does Alex have that put him a cut above?


To be blunt, access. We met well and got along and his teaching has been delivering solid results ever since. I see no reason to look elsewhere when I'm getting significant return on the investment from an existing relationship.

It developed over time, at first I only learned the sabre form to get back into weapons, then I kept going back for weekends when he came to Austin and getting more exposure to the material and the students. I honestly didn't think much of the style at first to be perfectly honest. I was sitting with Dong Zheng Chen and his wife going on about the HSS material. I was mainly attending to boost the numbers and support my friend Jane and her work with the Veterans.

That was mainly due to my first exposure being T. T. Liang's system and 150 posture form, which has influence from a number of lineages, chiefly Cheng Man Ching, and the Huang Sheng Shyan material through Adam Mizner which is also largely CMC influenced.

The forms and postures have been tuned differently. CMC is undeniably tweaked in favor of energy work and healing. If you're coming from that on first glance a lot of things the Dong family does seem "wrong" but really they're just keeping to older tradition that in my opinion maintains more of the martial spirit of the practice. When I started giving their movements a chance it was like night and day the difference in my development.

What really sold me was seeing the photos of him, his dad, his granddad, and his great granddad, and they are all doing the same thing. There may be some changes in the pedagogy but the body method is the same. You don't get a lot of quality control documented and illustrated so clearly in this field of interest.

If I were to go on and say too much.

I wouldn't try to rank people based on skill when any one of them is so much better than me that it doesn't matter anyhow, I don't see myself ever catching up. Like I am no badass, people make me step all the time in pushing. Not many people can make me stumble across the room or fall down at will, or at zero intensity from either of us and he can do that effortlessly.

His attitude and approach and eye is excellent. You're working the whole time in class and all of it feels productive. In pushing he invites you to try whatever you want and tells you that you should be ready for anything, punches, kicks, chokes, never know what somebody is going to do. Calls out invisible corrections from across the room or when not even looking.

But the important thing here, my own guidance regarding picking a teacher, doesn't matter WHAT that teacher has done or can do outside the classroom. What matters is how they get the knowledge out of their brain and body and into yours. Working with him I get the feeling that transmitting that knowledge is his first priority, and I always leave feeling tangible improvement. When I'm better than him maybe I'll look for an upgrade, but he's got a bit of a head start.

Wayne may not see it but I know I'm improving, I have video working with the same people over time to prove it even. :D

I even brought up the idea of a subscription type approach like Adam Mizner, $50 a month for a 5-10 minute video each week and his response was that sort of thing placed too much focus on the business over the learning.

Another reason I wanted to write this up was to let anybody else who might have a chance to attend a class or workshop know what they'd be missing if they passed it up. I could kick myself for the wasted year or so before I started committing to the style.
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby Trip on Tue Dec 12, 2023 9:55 pm

wayne hansen wrote:Sounds like one more step in the watering down of real teaching...


I don’t understand this statement Wayne

Are you saying that Alex Dong no longer teaches or offers
the complete Yang Long Form & Weapons?

Are you saying that he does not teach or offer the complete teachings
that his forefathers passed down to him through his family?
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Re: Teacher Profile

Postby Trick on Tue Dec 12, 2023 11:37 pm

origami_itto wrote:first I only learned the sabre form to get back into weapons, then I kept going back for weekends when he came to Austin and getting more exposure to the material and the students. I honestly didn't think much of the style at first.

He’s curriculum first teach the Dao and then a modified and “more balanced” short form of the first section of the long taijiquan form (that is already balanced) ?
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