Combine attacks in Xing Yi Quan?

[golden-tree]

Hi,

its my first post on this board and i will start directly with a question

Im a beginner in Xing Yi Quan.

I started training Xing Yis 5 element form but i can't imagine how to combine the 5 fists in attacking an oppenent.
How does it look wenn an Xing Yi practitioner attacks an opponent?

Is he just performing the 5 fists or does he add special other movements when he is rushing over his enemie?

At least excuse me for my bad english im from europe and i ll give my best that u understand me

[Wanderingdragon]

First you must learn the five fists, then you will learn how they are used in attack and defense.

[mixjourneyman]

To be a little less arcane: The five fists can be freely combined after you understand that they are not specifically performed exactly as they are in the solo form (I mean if you always tried to beng someone in the solar plexus as an attack, you will always get punched in the face).
Beng is my favourite for combinations. Basically you can rattle of three or five bengs in one step at multiple levels and if you are lucky, hit your opponent several times. Another one I like is step forward with you and then step backward and do a reverse side zuan to the chin.
Just work on your elements for now, but when you understand how to apply each of them in the standard way, work with a partner to do combos.

[fisherman]

Also understand that once you have trained each element for a while that they can be done in different ways and on different angles than what is presented in the forms.
I agree that you should work on the forms diligently and then progress to doing drills and some cooperative sparring so you can explore the different ways of applying the elements and the different combos that you can use.
I personally love using pi quan for an entry and then progressing to another from there (depending on what the reaction to the pi quan was).

Best regards,
Chris

[Felipe Bidó]

Hi, welcome to the forum.

As said by others, at the beginning is difficult to tell how you're going to use the fists, but after training them for a while you'll start to know them better and their use will be more clear to you.

In fighting, a Xingyi practicioner usually break the enemy's defense and when the opening is done, one of the attacks will be used; one of the five fists, the animals, etc.

Just be patient, try to learn the simple application of the fists, and practice, practice, practice.

[Wanderingdragon]

As said by others, at the beginning is difficult to tell how you're going to use the fists, but after training them for a while you'll start to know them better and their use will be more clear to you.

Also understand that once you have trained each element for a while that they can be done in different ways and on different angles than what is presented in the forms.

Just work on your elements for now, but when you understand how to apply each of them in the standard way, work with a partner to do combos.

I'm just not sure whaty is so arcane about what I said

[mixjourneyman]

First you must learn the five fists, then you will learn how they are used in attack and defense.

I just thought it was kind of vague to the point of being useless. My rationale for that is that all you really said amounts to "learn the five fists and then learn to fight with them" which doesn't really help the guy that much IMO. I wasn't trying to be insulting, just sharing my perspective on the question and how it was answered.

[johnwang]

How does it look when an Xing Yi practitioner attacks an opponent?

When you do something, your opponent will response something and he will expose part of his body. You then attack whatever that he has exposed to you. It's just like water always find the leak and flow into it. This is the common sense for all striking art and it's called - detect the leak. It's used in all CMA styles and not just Xing Yi.

[Wanderingdragon]

First you must learn the five fists, then you will learn how they are used in attack and defense.

I just thought it was kind of vague to the point of being useless. My rationale for that is that all you really said amounts to "learn the five fists and then learn to fight with them" which doesn't really help the guy that much IMO. I wasn't trying to be insulting, just sharing my perspective on the question and how it was answered.

Gotcha,
I just meant that once you learn the five fists, their uses will begin to open themselves up to you. Xing I is such a user friendly art that sometimes people miss out on the nuances and subtleties that make up the essence of the art , by bypassing one of the most important phases, something your own teacher actually did an article on.

[golden-tree]

Thanks for your answers. I will continue my training and concentrate on learning the correct use of the fists.
Later i will add partner practice and sparring.

[bigphatwong]

One thing you can do outdoors provided you don't have a training partner is to find a tree with a branch about head height, and practice your various entries on it...inside, outside, left & right. Also experiment with the transition from Infinity Posture to San Ti. The idea is that you can use any of the first three fists as a bridge and capture his centerline. Once that bridge is formed and your frame established in relation to your opponent, it's up to you how you want to enter...over the top, underneath, it doesn't matter.

The 5 fists are only different ways of expressing force, not specific techniques.

[mixjourneyman]

First you must learn the five fists, then you will learn how they are used in attack and defense.

I just thought it was kind of vague to the point of being useless. My rationale for that is that all you really said amounts to "learn the five fists and then learn to fight with them" which doesn't really help the guy that much IMO. I wasn't trying to be insulting, just sharing my perspective on the question and how it was answered.

Gotcha,
I just meant that once you learn the five fists, their uses will begin to open themselves up to you. Xing I is such a user friendly art that sometimes people miss out on the nuances and subtleties that make up the essence of the art , by bypassing one of the most important phases, something your own teacher actually did an article on.

I agree with you actually.
Although I have to say, about ten minutes after I learned how to throw a beng quan, my teacher showed me how to throw multiple beng's at multiple levels in an application format, so there must be something to learning how to do combinations from early on in training

[Wanderingdragon]

How does it look when an Xing Yi practitioner attacks an opponent?

When you do something, your opponent will response something and he will expose part of his body. You then attack whatever that he has exposed to you. It's just like water always find the leak and flow into it. This is the common sense for all striking art and it's called - detect the leak. It's used in all CMA styles and not just Xing Yi.

Different apps for different situations as you said we agree , there are combos in all the arts. But not in the sense of JabJab cross like boxing CMA flows into openings