Peng, Lu Ji An usage

[Josealb]

Chicago, it could help if you would post a clip of someone who you are impressed with. Just so people here can have an idea on the context of your viewpoints?

[XiaoXiong]

No that's framing the issue innappropriately. I think the point which you are missing once again, is that Mr. Su has impressed people like Luo Dexiu, and Chang Dong Sheng in his lifetime with his martial skills. Do you fancy yourself more difficult to impress than they were? You are obviously nobody in any position to question the efficacy of his fighting apps. If as you say, you believe that taiji can't become the thing's Mr.Su has shown in this video and still be taiji, than perhaps it is you who simply cannot recognize it, and not that the man is doing something wrong. I personally wouldn't practice the way Mr. Su does in these videos, but I can't criticise him from where I stand, because I know he knows more than I do, can do more than I can, and there is not a shred of evidence or rational thought to the contrary. Like it or not the same goes for you. You're position in things is nowhere but behind a keyboard from the POV of this board. What do you have to offer as evidence that we should listen to you? What are your accomplishments?
J
J

[chicagoTaiJi]

No that's framing the issue innappropriately. I think the point which you are missing once again, is that Mr. Su has impressed people like Luo Dexiu, and Chang Dong Sheng in his lifetime with his martial skills. Do you fancy yourself more difficult to impress than they were? You are obviously nobody in any position to question the efficacy of his fighting apps. If as you say, you believe that taiji can't become the thing's Mr.Su has shown in this video and still be taiji, than perhaps it is you who simply cannot recognize it, and not that the man is doing something wrong. I personally wouldn't practice the way Mr. Su does in these videos, but I can't criticise him from where I stand, because I know he knows more than I do, can do more than I can, and there is not a shred of evidence or rational thought to the contrary. Like it or not the same goes for you. You're position in things is nowhere but behind a keyboard from the POV of this board. What do you have to offer as evidence that we should listen to you? What are your accomplishments?
J
J

Why does inviting someone to be your student mean you are "impressed by their martial skills"?

Be your own man. Stop fawning over other people...

[DeusTrismegistus]

He was summoned by the legendary fighter, Master Chang Dong Sheng to become his pupil.

how long did he train under Chang? You know Chang's specialty is wrestling, not tai chi ?

If someone with no understanding of the method tries to do what Su is doing they are probably going to screw it up as with any other ima. Having never felt Mr. Su's skill my opinion of it is based on the opinions of those who I trust in martial arts, and what I can see for myself on video. He has body control, coordination, integration, and a presence of yi in his movements and postures at a very high level. Criticising his approach to training or his presentation of the form may carry some validity, but to question him as a martial artist in any way, is utterly ridiculous. This guy is not someone who is a rock star like Chuck Liddel or something. If he was doing now what he did in the seventies though, he would be scaring the shit out of guys like that though. That's my little synopsis of why you should look up to and respect Mr. Su. And remember he's like 50 something too.
J

I guess I'm not as easily impressed as you are...

Yea. You also aren't very good at answering questions.

Do you have a timestamp in particular in any of the vids which shows isolated limb movement against a presumed incoming strike?

Which of the hundred or so different ways to move your arm that were demonstrated are you assuming is the prefered poor punch defense?

Everyone here as far as I know is well aware of what GM Chang was an expert at. Some of us (Fong, Myself, I Walk The Circle, Pat) are more aware than others since we are being taught by students of GM Chang. Yes GM Chang was a skilled taiji practitioner as well, skilled enough to create his own style which he modified from Yang. He was also skilled in the other internal arts, especially xingyi.

So you have Su Dong Chen, who is a skilled practitioner of IMA and has been renowned for his fighting skills for several decades, who was skilled enough to be personally invited to study under GM Chang, and you say he is blocking wrong?

I don't want to sound offensive but what qualifies you to be able to make such claims. Why shouldn't we just ignore you from here on out as it seems you are just here trolling at this point.

[DeusTrismegistus]

No that's framing the issue innappropriately. I think the point which you are missing once again, is that Mr. Su has impressed people like Luo Dexiu, and Chang Dong Sheng in his lifetime with his martial skills. Do you fancy yourself more difficult to impress than they were? You are obviously nobody in any position to question the efficacy of his fighting apps. If as you say, you believe that taiji can't become the thing's Mr.Su has shown in this video and still be taiji, than perhaps it is you who simply cannot recognize it, and not that the man is doing something wrong. I personally wouldn't practice the way Mr. Su does in these videos, but I can't criticise him from where I stand, because I know he knows more than I do, can do more than I can, and there is not a shred of evidence or rational thought to the contrary. Like it or not the same goes for you. You're position in things is nowhere but behind a keyboard from the POV of this board. What do you have to offer as evidence that we should listen to you? What are your accomplishments?
J
J

Why does inviting someone to be your student mean you are "impressed by their martial skills"?

Be your own man. Stop fawning over other people...

Be your own man, start answering the questions that have been directed toward you.

[DeusTrismegistus]

'peng' as a posture/movement/application? More than once; the first time is back of his left hand to the face, at 0:07

why would one 'peng' someone's head (when one can easily miss), rather than using a good old-fashioned punch?

Why do you think Peng misses the head any easier than a good old fashioned punch?

I am still waiting for your answer to this.

Which ironically, I got "penged" in the nose last night, that kinda hurt. Sparring with partners with self control FTW.

[XiaoXiong]

I have no idea what you are talking about now. What exactly would be involved in your program of " being my own man". I have put my introduction on this board. I'm putting forth a valid opinion, negating your invalid opinion. I'm hardly fawning. I don't love Mr. Su's videos, and I don't espouse his method of training. But I come from the same family of martila arts and understand the education his body has had from direct personnal experience over a period of years. I can say that I recognize the mechanics employed in his applications and find them sound, because I have learned those same techniques from my own teacher and have used them and had them used on me before. So I am my own man. Who do you think you are to be so egotistic? To tell me like this. You are a man with a computer and a bad attitude. That doesn't qualify you for any more of my attention. That's for sure. We all have much to learn.
J

[chicagoTaiJi]

I am still waiting for your answer to this.

At 0:07, he (Su) has his (student's) face wide open and is controlling one of his (students) arms, so he should hit the face. as he did... peng is using the whole body, not an arm, that strike is not what the 'peng' motion teaches. feel free to disagree, and nice speaking to you.

[DeusTrismegistus]

I am still waiting for your answer to this.

At 0:07, he (Su) has his (student's) face wide open and is controlling one of his (students) arms, so he should hit the face. as he did... peng is using the whole body, not an arm, that strike is not what the 'peng' motion teaches. feel free to disagree, and nice speaking to you.

Your answer to why Peng misses the head easier than an old fashioned punch is becase peng is using the whole body and not the arm? That doesn't answer the question at all.

Why do you think that he was only using the arm to strike with? It looks to me like he is opening the chest and shoulders when he strikes.

What does the Peng motion teach then?

There was also 2 questions by TaoJoannes I am looking forward to seeing an answer on.

[chicagoTaiJi]

The point was that if you are going to execute the "peng" motion, you make contact and exert that energy.

Why would you pick a small, far away target to do that?

[DeusTrismegistus]

The point was that if you are going to execute the "peng" motion, you make contact and exert that energy.

Why would you pick a small, far away target to do that?

What does it matter what target you pick? What energy? And why cant you exert energy then make contact?

"I don't want to sound offensive but what qualifies you to be able to make such claims. Why shouldn't we just ignore you from here on out as it seems you are just here trolling at this point." Quoting myself. What is your qualifications? How long have you been practicing taiji? Who is your teacher? What style?

[chicagoTaiJi]

so if you're out hunting, and someone asks you why you're aiming for the deer's eye, you answer "why does it matter what target i pick" ?

[DeusTrismegistus]

so if you're out hunting, and someone asks you why you're aiming for the deer's eye, you answer "why does it matter what target i pick" ?

That is a useless comparison. A fight is not the same as ambushing a deer with a rifle. I fight is a dynamic situation which is constantly shifting and positions change as do available targets. The head is a great target in a fight.

You said the head was harder to hit with Peng than with an old fashioned punch, when asked why your answer was that striking the head is not how peng is supposed to be used. That does not answer the original question.
So...

Why do you think that he was only using the arm to strike with? It looks to me like he is opening the chest and shoulders when he strikes.

What does the Peng motion teach then?

What does it matter what target you pick? What energy? And why cant you exert energy then make contact?

"I don't want to sound offensive but what qualifies you to be able to make such claims. Why shouldn't we just ignore you from here on out as it seems you are just here trolling at this point." Quoting myself. What is your qualifications? How long have you been practicing taiji? Who is your teacher? What style?

[chicagoTaiJi]

it's not a comparison, it's an analogy to show that such a question does not make sense

[DeusTrismegistus]

it's not a comparison, it's an analogy to show that such a question does not make sense

For an analogy to be valid the situation has to be comparable. It is not.


You said the head was harder to hit with Peng than with an old fashioned punch, when asked why your answer was that striking the head is not how peng is supposed to be used. That does not answer the original question.
So...

Why do you think that he was only using the arm to strike with? It looks to me like he is opening the chest and shoulders when he strikes.

What does the Peng motion teach then?

What does it matter what target you pick? What energy? And why cant you exert energy then make contact?

"I don't want to sound offensive but what qualifies you to be able to make such claims. Why shouldn't we just ignore you from here on out as it seems you are just here trolling at this point." Quoting myself. What is your qualifications? How long have you been practicing taiji? Who is your teacher? What style?