Does anyone know this Tong Bei Form???

[Monkfit Master]

Some help please if you can. Does anyone know the name of this Tong Bei Form? I was taught is in China in 2005 but it's not strictly speaking the style of Tong Bei I practice (although it is related). My Shihfu is not sure of the name either as he learnt it years ago when he lived in Luoyang.

Frist Part




Mid Section

[SPJ]

Frist Part

dun know the name of the forms but

they are splitting the door or lie men and then drilling fist (zhuan quan/zhang) high left and right and mid forward

one circular arm move (chan) to open the door, then drilling fist forward.

ended with axe palm or pi shan.

if I have to name it, it would be lie men zhuan zhang.

[SPJ]

Mid Section

after pi shan or li pi hua shan or chopping/splitting china mountain with great force

there is a double pushing palm or tui zhang, it may also be called pushing mountain or tui shan.

then, a series of circular arm moves with retreating steps, to fend off the opponent's attacking arms, it may be called swinging your sleeve/collar, or huo xio. the old chinese clothes were with long sleeves and collars.

then high drilling fist and then mid level drilling fist or zhong quan.

tong bei practices are usually consisted of several palm methods in combo.

in this case, they are mainly drilling fist/palm,

thanks for posting.

cool.

[C.J.Wang]

Traditionally, Tong Bei had no forms. The style consisted of various short repetitive drills done over and over. Forms were invented later on.

[Monkfit Master]

Traditionally, Tong Bei had no forms. The style consisted of various short repetitive drills done over and over. Forms were invented later on.

This was the first time I'd seen a Tong Bei form. I Study Zhong Hua Si Mian Ba Fang Tong Bei Quan. It's not straight pure Tong Bei. My Shihfu Mike Farr used to live in Luoyang and his Shihfu Wang Hong Jun introduced him to his training brother a Tong Bei master called Qui Ji Zhong who’s pure Tong Bei art is related to our art. Mike studied a lot with Qui Ji Zhong in the years he lived in Luoyang, and when Mike told him he was moving back to Wales Qui gave him permission to teach his side of the art. When Mike explained the restrictions on training time in the west (the apprentice that was teaching us was expected to train for 9 hours a day) Qui gave mike 8, as you so aptly put it "short repetitive drills" to teach which represent the whole of his art. Until I went to China in 2005 this was the only way I'd trained in pure Tong (we have 4 sets in Ba Fang Tong Bei). It was really useful for me personally to train in this "new" way. The Form is supposed to be more or less 1 long continuous move. Linking these movements really helped the fluidity of my fighting, especially against multiple attackers. Moving continuously until everything around you has stopped moving.

This is one of the drills we do

[salcanzonieri]

The first section is the intro section to many tong bei sets,
I have documented one set "Strange Shape Flower Intesrecting Cannon" or "Qi Xing Hua Ji Pao" documented here:
http://www.bgtent.com/naturalcma/CMAart ... nChart.htm (go to the bottom of the page, download the PDF file, and look at the second to last column on the right.

There you will see the form and the name of the movements
and it follows the same movements until move "Press Down Hidden Palm".
That's the usual entry section.

(Also, it's not true that there are not Tong Bei quan sets. It's just that most people outside of Henan area do not know them, they just practice the drills. Ask Dr. Yan, he can tell you, he's been talking about some of the forms that date back to 1600s.)

[Monkfit Master]

This is very useful info. Thanks for your reply.

[SPJ]

This is one of the drills we do

cool.

pi zhang with the back bending down, too.

usually we leave one hand on our chest/heart or near abdomen, to protect while the other hand striking out.

we switch roles of hands very fast. attacking and defending.

--

my sis used to coin names for stuff I did.

If I was practicing tong bei, with one hand on the abdomen, bending back etc, as in the vid posted. She said I have a stomache or tu zi tong.

If I was practicing ba ji, she said I look like a tofu jerkie so square or to fu gan.

some of my high school friends coming over in our beach house. oh some how, we always live close to the ocean.

She would said I am doing tu zi tong or to fu gan etc etc.

[kenneth fish]

Sal is right - its a variation of the qixing wuhua pao - a form generally associated with wuxing tongbei.

[salcanzonieri]

Sal is right - its a variation of the qixing wuhua pao - a form generally associated with wuxing tongbei.

Thanks.

Do you or anyone else know where there is a video available of the qixing wuhua pao set?
I learned it long ago, and i don't want to forget it.

There are three versions of it, a 24 move, a 53 move, and a 72 move.

[kenneth fish]

Yes, there is a link to one of Chang Songsheng's people doing the form. Let me dig it up.

[kenneth fish]

Here it is:

http://www.tongbei.com/mov/qixing.mov

[salcanzonieri]

Here it is:

http://www.tongbei.com/mov/qixing.mov

Great! Thanks very much, must appreciated!

[salcanzonieri]

Here it is:

http://www.tongbei.com/mov/qixing.mov

Amazing that if you slow this form down to TJQ speed, you can see finally how it relates to Chen TJQ (at least)
as Dr. Yan has been pointing out and as my chart shows in the posture by posture correspondence.

[Monkfit Master]

Sal is right - its a variation of the qixing wuhua pao - a form generally associated with wuxing tongbei.

Thanks for the info. I’ll look into it further.

By the way I’d like to take this opportunity to say thanks. I attended a Xing Yi course you held at Sifu Dale’s Eagle Claw School in the UK about 7 or 8 years ago. I was actually talking about you yesterday to one of my teachers so it is a bit over a coincidence that you have replied to this. I often refer to that seminar as you thought principles of body mechanics, movement, and power issuing that can be used and expanded on throughout ones martial career rather than a set form which may be forgotten in 1 month, 1 year, 10 years... You taught Herbi Xing Yi Tiger back and dragon back. I never got to grips with the Tiger Back, but I loved the Dragon Back. At the time I was studying mainly Chang Quan, Baji, Pigua, and I’d done the smallest bit of Xing Yi. Actually I stopped Xing Yi shortly after your course as it wasn’t a strength in my club and concentrated on Baji and Pigua although I still practiced Dragon Back occasionally. I’d moved away (200 + miles) a few years later but while still training with my old school I found Zhong Hua Si Main Ba Fang Tong Bei Quan. I since then left my old school as Ba Fang Tong Bei is too vast a system and my teacher has so much he wants to pass on I couldn’t do both. As I first started to learn Tong Bei I was put in mind of the Dragon Back you taught. Is there any connection? Are they related, just similar principles or neither and got it all wrong?