the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

Hi Chris,

I've been thinking about this over lunch, and I think the internal pressure you create in reverse breathing adds to the stretching potential. I should have just written that - it would have been shorter

(It also helps to initiate the back bow, but more of that.... later....)

I've been thinking about this over lunch, and I think the internal pressure you create in reverse breathing adds to the stretching potential. I should have just written that - it would have been shorter

(It also helps to initiate the back bow, but more of that.... later....)

Thanks for taking the time.

b.t.w if anybody would like to learn more about the breathing methods than I've mentioned in my brief clip then this video by Chen Zhaosen is gold:

https://vimeo.com/63562043

middleway wrote:The 'normal' belly breathing (I should have probably called it diaphramatic breathing to be clearer)...

No, you should call it belly breathing. All breathing (outside of very nasty diseases) is diaphragmatic breathing. Although, if I recall correctly, "breathing" technically only refers to exhalation, so maybe you should call it "abdominally dynamic respiration", or something like that. 'Cause that's totally clear...

In our tai chi we have 4 distinctive breathing patterns
I don't choose to consciously choose to do reverse breathing but have done it at certain times
It can happen naturally
A lot of people I have seen think they are doing reverse breathing but are over time revert to intercostal breathing
The main reason for reverse breath is to massage the organs below the diaphragm
For most people it is best practiced outside of form practice and for its health benefits
In some ways it can become a form of double weighting
So buyer beware

wayne hansen wrote:The main reason for reverse breath is to massage the organs below the diaphragm

One of the reasons for which I was taught it was to increase developed force/"power".

I would love to see some examples of this increased power

No, you should call it belly breathing. All breathing (outside of very nasty diseases) is diaphragmatic breathing. Although, if I recall correctly, "breathing" technically only refers to exhalation, so maybe you should call it "abdominally dynamic respiration", or something like that. 'Cause that's totally clear...

Well that isn't a term that I just pulled out of my ass . If you do a PubMed search on the term you can find it used alongside terms like 'deep breathing' in numerous studies across a number of disciplines.

I don't think anyone is suggestion that the diaphragm isn't used in all breathing in those studies or here.

I am pretty sure this isn't the topic of the thread however.

Thanks

middleway wrote:

No, you should call it belly breathing. All breathing (outside of very nasty diseases) is diaphragmatic breathing. Although, if I recall correctly, "breathing" technically only refers to exhalation, so maybe you should call it "abdominally dynamic respiration", or something like that. 'Cause that's totally clear...

Well that isn't a term that I just pulled out of my ass :P . If you do a PubMed search on the term you can find it used alongside terms like 'deep breathing' in numerous studies across a number of disciplines.

I don't think anyone is suggestion that the diaphragm isn't used in all breathing in those studies or here.

I am pretty sure this isn't the topic of the thread however. :)

Thanks

I was mostly just giving you a hard time, but it is worth occasionally pointing out where - even in PubMed - people use an approximation because it's common terminology or "close enough", and then in IMA forums (or wherever) folks go on to have these exceedingly detailed arguments about minutiae of subjective phenomena based off of "close enough" foundations. Plus, tropes tend to annoy me. It's a thing.

Always enjoy your perspective, though.

I was mostly just giving you a hard time, but it is worth occasionally pointing out where - even in PubMed - people use an approximation because it's common terminology or "close enough",

Thats alright I dont mind a bit of piss taking now and then. Agreed on PubMed.

Cheers.

charles wrote: One of the viewers tried the exercise and reported here that it was helpful to him in feeling a connection. One can't argue against subjective feelings: one can't state the feelings are "incorrect"

Nope. I'm pretty sure that guy was talking about the substantive body-unity he has practiced for more than a couple of decades being reproduced through the methods Graham is showing in his notebook series. Albeit, with a slightly modified posture (head and neck alignment).

Nothing subjective at all since the same body-unity has been trained and tested by himself and a bunch his training partners in various competitive formats. Practicable and repeatable without "feeling" anything. It's either substantial, or it isn't.

Lesson 1 is similar to the way 'connection' is explored and tested using Polish-mirror
Lesson 2 is similar to the way 'connection' is explored and tested using Cloud-hands
Lesson 3 is similar to the way 'connection' is explored and tested while transitioning into, and out of White-stork (as he mentioned in one of his posts).

None of that Yin/Yang gobbledygoop or meridians or...

Hey, Graham

Your training series is starting to teeter on the rails a bit with lesson 4. It needs tweaking. The language could be more direct and meaningful with a plainly written outline.

Abdomen - not andomin

Reverse breathing is a natural breath during the rising portion of Polish-mirror

Bruce, I may be off the rails, but I know where the train is going

Bruce I find what saying a little hard to understand a clip might help