the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

GrahamB wrote:And, er, Wayne - I think that's you they're talking about at 4.50..... ;D

That's actually a good illustration of the types of flaws that are in these videos from a self defense perspective. People are pussies for worrying about their knees "when they might get stabbed or beaten to death", but the takedown they showed leaves the arms totally free to stab at the head and neck during the takedown if, in fact, the intent was to stab someone to death. 'Gami mentioned the legal risks of a big throw-- I would suggest it's a bigger legal risk to be on top of someone, pinning their arms and bouncing their head off the asphalt. The purpose of a big throw in self defense is to stay on your feet and buy time to escape-- not so much with ground and pound.

That doesn't necessarily make any of what they show bad in and of itself, but there are many important elements that are just ignored or glossed over.

People are pussies for worrying about their knees "when they might get stabbed or beaten to death"

I would gladly sacrifice my knees to save my life. I think most people would, and worry about the injuries later.

That misses the point. Their justification for risking the knees is that there might be knives involved, but the technique they show is very risky against a knife. Never mind the logical dysfunction of the idea that breaking your knees is an acceptable trade, since if you break your knees you have no means of escape-- better hope you can handle the one guy (with broken knees) and hope there's no one around waiting to kick you in the face while you're lying on the ground.

Why couldn't they answer the question like adults and say "if you do it properly, your knees are safe" and then go into more detail about how to protect your knees when going to the ground on hard, uneven surfaces?

I was agreeing that people rarely worry about their knees or any other body part when their lives are in danger. And, I was assuming that I couldn't run away or escape. But, I didn't mean to argue.

wayne hansen wrote:

middleway wrote:

First clip I would hate to see what happens to his knees doing that on the street

Well as someone who has done that on concrete let me enlighten you. Some grazing And slight bruising the next day ... shock horror!!!

No way will you enlighten me
So one time you did it and landed on smooth level concrete
If you use that as a regular thing to do in the street one day you will get up with a smashed patella

As for the fact that you don't have to land on your knees that's my point
He is training to land on his knees not even on judo mats but gymnastic mats

I agree. I do not see a reason to land on your knees, when there are other, more effective trips and throws.

wayne hansen wrote:I notice that you didn't address my second point that the blows were so slow my grannie would have stopped them

Yes. They put on protective gear. Then, the feeder doesn't retract his punch. I don't see the point of that. Some of the ideas were useful, others not.

Bhassler wrote:Why couldn't they answer the question like adults and say "if you do it properly, your knees are safe" and then go into more detail about how to protect your knees when going to the ground on hard, uneven surfaces?

I think you are making the assumption that this is aimed at adults

We must make the best of those things that are in our power, and take the rest as nature gives it.

-Epictetus, Duscources, I.i

well
in 3rd clip , they are mopin` Jake`s, while their own clips are not better or even worse...

I`m absolutely against throw in kneeling position, you may do it much better and with control when using deep sit ups /seoinage example/.
From Gracies wins in UFC, BJJ - aka works on the ground, appears like ultimate weapon
but
it isn`t.,
Chocking someone is nice and holds his high position in the sport + some rare cases, however require time which is very restricted in the real fight.

I remember stupid argue with older guy /I was young and unexperienced/,
suddenly he picked up knife from his pocked,- I sow clearly his move , but didn`t react properly and he has the time...
hopefully for me it was open space and I had place to run away.