the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

@Bao, I think you are being disingenuous in your comments. For all of the styles we are talking about (Yang, Hao, Wu), there is lots of evidence that they were originally practiced with lots more fajin and kicks. See for example Wu Tunan's and Dong Yingjie's comments about Yang Shaohou, or the multiple examples of the Hao form done with fajin coming out of Yongnian / Xingtai area, or even Fu Zhongwen's single fajin movement exercises.

At the end of the day taiji is a martial art and involves striking - to train striking you need to train fajin, end of story.

But you never see anybody striking with fajin, just shaking their arms in the air.

Most fa Jin I see is just karate Kime
Fa Jin should arise naturally out of correct form
It should be more like holding back a runaway horse

nicklinjm wrote:@Bao, I think you are being disingenuous in your comments. For all of the styles we are talking about (Yang, Hao, Wu), there is lots of evidence that they were originally practiced with lots more fajin and kicks. See for example Wu Tunan's and Dong Yingjie's comments about Yang Shaohou, or the multiple examples of the Hao form done with fajin coming out of Yongnian / Xingtai area, or even Fu Zhongwen's single fajin movement exercises.

I like that you said “for all of the styles” instead of just “forms”. Because this is what we should talk about, the whole styles and not only the forms. If you look at more clips from that old frame Wu lineage I posted, you can see that they have a pao chui striking form as well. They practice a lot of punching and they have many different ways to practice their forms. I don’t like the generalization that “forms should include fajin”. Forms have always had been practiced in many different ways. There is no “this is the right way”. And there are many different ways to practice punching skills, you dont’t need to always put everything in the form.

At the end of the day taiji is a martial art and involves striking - to train striking you need to train fajin...

Not really. The type of movements that are usually seen called fajin is good practice but in the end also overrated. There are other types of practicing striking and power generation that are equally important but usually forgotten by practitioners who spend a lot of time practicing powerful looking shaking fajin.

oragami_itto wrote:But you never see anybody striking with fajin, just shaking their arms in the air.

Exactly. Better to strike against something instead of just thin air.

wayne hansen wrote:Most fa Jin I see is just karate Kime
Fa Jin should arise naturally out of correct form
It should be more like holding back a runaway horse

Agreed

Although I practice Yang Taiji in the Fu Zhongwen Tradition im not impressed by the FaJin I’ve seen online done by FZW or his son. My TJQ teacher in that tradition I’ve only seen doing force issuing during sparring and equipment practice and in its special way done in Tongbeiquan practice.…The only one that so far impressed me with Force issuing in thin air is my YiQuan teacher, although his technique didn’t look that powerful the whole room where actually vibrating when he do it.

Trick wrote:Although I practice Yang Taiji in the Fu Zhongwen Tradition im not impressed by the FaJin I’ve seen online done by FZW or his son.

Agree. They seem to do it mostly by arm movement. People who look like having some good fajin power like Chen Yu (Chen TJQ) or He Jinbao (Yin Bagua), they drive the force from the center: dantian, kua, waist or whatever. FZW has a good pushing power though. That snappy arms practice might have been unnecessary for what he seems to have accomplished.