Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby C.J.W. on Sat Feb 23, 2019 2:53 am

The acorn has certainly not fallen far from the tree.
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby GrahamB on Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:07 am

wayne hansen wrote:Not looking too hard then


Don't get me wrong- I like a cover of Heart of Gold as much as the next Neil Young fan, but I can't see much in the way of martial here...

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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby Bao on Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:14 am

There are links on the RSF to Wayne’s YouTube channel. At least ten, fifteen clips if I remember correct, mostly form applications. I know the name of the channel and YouTube name, and how to find it, not that hard...
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby GrahamB on Sat Feb 23, 2019 3:38 am

If it's so easy to find... why can't somebody just post a link?

Third time of asking now...
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby wayne hansen on Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:24 am

northern_mantis wrote:
wayne hansen wrote:Still want to see you do something


Don't do online video but happily meet up for push hands or maybe a bit of MOQ if in the mood (takes a while to get going being the wrong side of 40).


No idea what MOQ is
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby GrahamB on Sat Feb 23, 2019 5:38 am

boxing wanyee, it’s boxing.
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby Bao on Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:03 am

GrahamB wrote:If it's so easy to find... why can't somebody just post a link?

Third time of asking now...


Lol! You really give up too easy. Hint: Take a look at the first page of the main (first) board.
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby Bill on Sat Feb 23, 2019 12:47 pm

Hint....

Think of a number between nineny and elevenny.
Last edited by Bill on Sat Feb 23, 2019 12:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby GrahamB on Sat Feb 23, 2019 2:44 pm

Found it!

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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby wayne hansen on Sat Feb 23, 2019 9:02 pm

Uncle choppy would not have been allowed to hang with the guys I grew up with
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby Trick on Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:03 pm

northern_mantis wrote:Erle hit harder than anybody else I've held pads for which include Olympic level boxers and Pro Muay Thai fighters. He could show how to derive that level of power through form practice and standing although as far as I can tell he figured that out for himself rather than was taught it.

from your posts it seem youhave done some (higher level?)boxing, did you boxing spar with Montaigue ?
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby northern_mantis on Sun Feb 24, 2019 11:25 am

Trick wrote:
northern_mantis wrote:Erle hit harder than anybody else I've held pads for which include Olympic level boxers and Pro Muay Thai fighters. He could show how to derive that level of power through form practice and standing although as far as I can tell he figured that out for himself rather than was taught it.

from your posts it seem youhave done some (higher level?)boxing, did you boxing spar with Montaigue ?


Just amateur Western and Thai boxing but was lucky enough to train with a couple of Olympic team boxers and a number of guys who fought professionally in Thailand. Don't rate my own skills too highly but they were terrifyingly clinical so have sparred with top guys (and some girls that could kick my ass).

Didn't spar with Earl, the official WTBA party line was "too deadly too spar with" which obviously is a shitty argument but I held pads for him and from push hands tempted him in to some free play. Hid level of control was incredible and he could hand out a dead arm from contact which ached like a bitch for ages!

Basically because of his personal attributes and his training he was someone that I wouldn't have recommended tangling with. As to where his skills came from I believed maybe 10% of it but I think because of his rock and roll background he didn't mind spinning a yarn for effect. Just my opinion.
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby cloudz on Mon Feb 25, 2019 6:06 am

northern_mantis wrote:Erle hit harder than anybody else I've held pads for which include Olympic level boxers and Pro Muay Thai fighters. He could show how to derive that level of power through form practice and standing although as far as I can tell he figured that out for himself rather than was taught it.


Maybe that's all he did or could do though - hit pads or bags.
Never saw him hit a moving target, or one that ever tried to hit back..

In fact he was one of those too deadly to spar guys wasn't he?
Excuse me if i'm not falling over myself to hug his damn nuts!

Erle talked it up a hell of a lot, but never put it on the line. Even had the temerity to challenge gracie jj from all accounts.
Despite some views, the least we can say about Docherty is he took fights. Rather than hide behind the too deadly BS
Even if at the time his tai chi experience wasn't all that great I'd speculate..

Having said that i can see that Montague was "a fighter" in the traditional sense anyway.
I can see him being a tough guy. But honestly, the worlds full of those kind of guys.
Tough and can hit hard..

I have not heard one account of anyone from his worlwide org. ever fighting with or for their TCC training.
It tells me something; what does that tell you..

His training would certainly set him apart from your average untrained person.
But in amongst trained fighters he would soon go from hero to zero, imo.

You can just know that by the way he and his group trained, as well as the stuff they trained..
Eli, really is a chip off the old block. No doubt about that. ;D
Last edited by cloudz on Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:05 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby northern_mantis on Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:32 am

cloudz wrote:
northern_mantis wrote:Erle hit harder than anybody else I've held pads for which include Olympic level boxers and Pro Muay Thai fighters. He could show how to derive that level of power through form practice and standing although as far as I can tell he figured that out for himself rather than was taught it.


Maybe that's all he did or could do though - hit pads or bags.
Never saw him hit a moving target, or one that ever tried to hit back..

In fact he was one of those too deadly to spar guys wasn't he?
Excuse me if i'm not falling over myself to hug his damn nuts!

Erle talked it up a hell of a lot, but never put it on the line. Even had the temerity to challenge gracie jj from all accounts.
Despite his other faults the least we can say about Docherty is he took fights. Rather than hide behind the too deadly BS
Even if at the time his tai chi experience wasn't all that great.

Having said that i can see that Montague was "a fighter" in the traditional sense anyway.
I can see him being a tough guy. But honestly, the worlds full of those kind of guys.
Tough and can hit hard..

I have not heard one account of anyone from his worlwide org. ever fighting with or for their TCC training.
It tells me something; what does that tell you..

His training would certainly set him apart from your average untrained person.
But in amongst trained fighters he would soon go from hero to zero, imo.

You can just know that by the way he and his group trained, as well as the stuff they trained..
Eli, really is a chip off the old block. No doubt about that. ;D


Factually I agree and as per my previous post the WTBA policy was "too deadly to spar" though you could persuade him towards some free play by breaking the rules of whatever drill you were doing and whenever I did he would hand out a dead arm from point of contact which I though was really impressive and bloody painful!

However I would put a slightly more positive spin on it. The training had some decent elements and I would have put my money on him against any of the big name Tai Chi teachers I have met for what it's worth.
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Re: Tai Chi Form Applications — Eli Montaigue

Postby cloudz on Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:04 am

I kind of agree with you, got no real problem, just not my cup of tea in general. Interestingly, didn't he have some wrestling background. I think it might have been worked wrestling here in the Uk but still, I got a few of his dvd's way back when. I think with any big org. and with so much material, quality is going to be patchy. I saw some guys and drills that were nice. Him performing Da Lu I still think is one of the better that I've seen - loved the intensity they had. Similar with the 2 person san shou. Then there was some things I saw let's say much less impressive.. met the my local WTBA instructor; I guess overall one thing and another I was turned off it all and it wasn't for me.

I just think with so much material, the top end have to spread themselves so thin, even full time it would be a job to be good at it all, on a consistent basis. No doubt he was a major taiji enthusiast and practiced a lot, so I'm not surprised he developed some nice things to demo.. I mean a lot of people I have time for, had time for him so I can certainly respect that. He was leaning a lot into the dim mak and Ko stuff a bit like Dillman. Michael Babin who used to post here joined up with his org. And i don't know if you recall Chris Mkcinley from here, but he knew his shit I beleive. But then I also met guys here in the Uk who jumped to teachers I was training with at the time and they weren't so complimentary so it's a really mixed bag with Erle, certainly.
Last edited by cloudz on Thu Feb 28, 2019 6:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
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