Push hands yang vs wu

[Trick]

Can’t see the vid, maybe I can search the Chinese tubes. What’s the name of the Yang/Fu line guy, and the Wu is that the Wu or Wu/Hao, what’s the names of the combatants ?

Fu as Fu Zhongwen - Yang Zhenduo - Sam Masich. Too lazy to check up the name of Sam's student, sorry.

This is actually Damon Bramich's student Micah Guglielmi. Damon's the one sharing these lately. Here's another with Damon, he's the shorter fellow. He's very proud of his Fu lineage and is always posting pictures of himself with Fu Zhongwen and his son.

Push Hands British Traditional Taiji C-ships Heavy Weight Final 2016


So for me, like most of you, looking at it I don't see what I consider Taijiquan, just some shoving. But is that accurate? If the other guy is training taiji then shouldn't he be able to resist at least some? It reminds me of Mario Napoli in Chen village. If what he did was wrong, how did he beat all those people doing it "right"? Or has "right" just disappeared from the earth? Is what they're doing "better"?

Trick, I added some details that might help you find it on Chinese tubes

ah, thanks. i tought it was about some chinese "heavyweight" masters. but it was not.......then its nothing interestin, i think

[richardg6]

I got bounced from 2 fb groups for saying the same thing concluded here. No talent, no taiji, no manners. This was never about Yang vs Wu. Jacky is a gentleman and a great representative of Wu family style and a master of the art.

[windwalker]

Many have commented on lack of skill among those who are not considered masters in the OP clip.
Some of the people in the clip are acknowledged masters

Can some one point out the differences between the 2 clips





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4T4r_TDvmI

Li Enjiu vs. Unknown.

Wei Shuren vs. Men Huifeng.

Li Bingci vs. Lin Mogen.

Liu Chengde vs. Unknown.

Xin Yuhe vs. Men Huifeng

[Ian C. Kuzushi]

Many have commented on lack of skill among those who are not considered masters in the OP clip.
Some of the people in the clip are acknowledged masters

Can some one point out the differences between the 2 clips





https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4T4r_TDvmI

Li Enjiu vs. Unknown.



Wei Shuren vs. Men Huifeng.

Li Bingci vs. Lin Mogen.

Liu Chengde vs. Unknown.

Xin Yuhe vs. Men Huifeng

This video seems quite different to me in a couple of ways which made it more enjoyable for me. They start with a different mindset that is less competition oriented. There is clearly much more relaxation and listening, which allows them to probe and test each other. They build up to techniques rather than going all out right off the bat.

The other videos show the results of a competition. They don't want the other to put a hand on them. They want to treat the rival as a penny that they will bounce off of their drum. It's not necessarily wrong, it's just very different. I assume they also play in a way similar to the above video when not in a tournament setting.

Judo tournaments are a lot like this until people get more advanced. Very tense, less listening, more power, less finesse. Some of it is just nerves, some of it is level. Some of it is a combination.

Edited for formatting

[Rhen]

looks like they pushed on each others hands and one of them pushed the other. One didnt neutralize and the other got pushed out. isn't that push hands? DUH!

[windwalker]

Judo tournaments are a lot like this until people get more advanced. Very tense, less listening, more power, less finesse. Some of it is just nerves, some of it is level. Some of it is a combination.

Interesting observation. Having worked with two people I knew who were Olympic level Judoka Originally from France immigrated to the US They said exactly the same things feeling at the upper levels the “spirit“ of the art was not there.

They wanted to learn some taiji from me, and were quite surprised they were unable to throw me.
Not saying they couldn’t throw me, just at that time they were unable to...

Judo very honest and straightforward art, develops lots of spirit.


Regarding the clip as you noted the tone is very different.
Having judged push hands competitions in the past.
For me the clips are very similar in technique and application done for the same reasons.

edited: for clarity

[Bao]

Can some one point out the differences between the 2 clips
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4T4r_TDvmI

Li Enjiu vs. Unknown.

Wei Shuren vs. Men Huifeng.

Li Bingci vs. Lin Mogen.

Liu Chengde vs. Unknown.

Xin Yuhe vs. Men Huifeng

When I saw it the first time it was all terrible boring, but when I took time and looked through it and payed more attention, I liked some of what I saw. Wei Shuren makes himself very, very heavy. Men Huifeng who is the most aggressive tries sudden attacks on Wei but cannot move him. Lin Mogen also show some interesting things, as very explosive, sudden fajin coming from no visible preparation. Should be very hard for anyone to cope with. The only one here I particularly don’t like is Men Huifeng. He has a highly competitive mindset. Unnecessarily aggressive and you can see that when he meets someone who isn’t taken off guard and still is able to relax and make himself heavy, Men’s straight forward approach doesn’t work very well. If I was going to compare the Yang guy in the OP vid with anyone here in this video, it would be Men. I suspect that Masich’s student with his single minded mindset would find himself outmatched by either Wei, Lin or Men.

... I always thought that the fights in Superman 2 were badly thought out. When Superman and Lex fight, it should look like two regular people fight. They should have body strength enough to defend themselves and not be thrown away far away. You can easily fajin away someone who is unskilled, have no root and haven’t experienced this type of method. But do it on someone skilled who can sink, root and adjust to incoming movement is different. I can understand why people complain about regular tuishou matches, but I do think that a lot of what we see here is different from most regular tournaments. But I suspect that many people would have a hard time to see the difference.

[Trick]

heres Lin Mogen against some "bank clerk"? https://m.baidu.com/sf?pd=video_page&ni ... 6700221424

[Trick]

i did find the Lin Mogen vs Li Binci fight interesting, since i studied some with Li Binci's group in Beijing and later also learned the 115 form of LiYaxuan in the linage of his son in law Chen Longxiang .......however from vids i see of lin mogen teaching PH i get no good vibes about him. Li Binco however never showed off "magic stuff" and had a sensible approach to his teaching.

[Bao]

i did find the Lin Mogen vs Li Binci fight interesting, since i studied some with Li Binci's group in Beijing and later also learned the 115 form of LiYaxuan in the linage of his son in law Chen Longxiang .......however from vids i see of lin mogen teaching PH i get no good vibes about him. Li Binco however never showed off "magic stuff" and had a sensible approach to his teaching.

Don’t remember seeing any magical stuff from Lin Mogen, would be interesting to see what you are referring to.