Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

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Re: Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

Postby origami_itto on Mon May 02, 2022 7:46 pm

Formosa Neijia wrote:
cloudz wrote:
origami_itto wrote:No I don't believe this format has anything whatsoever to offer as proof of anything related to Taijiquan skills.

so why can't you show your yielding skills, positioning, your ability to move someone, who is trying to move you?
how is it different other that intensity.
help me understand
i've competed and do what you do as well, so I'm not clueless about this.
I have years of experience, and I just don't get your attitude.
if you have never tried it, how can you really have a credible opinion about whether it would help your development or not ?

It's all about maintaining their superiority attitude. They sit in judgement of anyone competing while never having to step up to the plate themselves. You listed the many attributes that this develops, but by avoiding competing like this they don't have to expose that they can't make those attributes work against a resisting opponent while still being able to criticize everyone else that has the guts to get out there.

Really, it's what the weak do -- tear down the strong.


Interesting.

Can you point to evidence of my alleged "superiority attitude" or sitting in judgment of anyone or their training?

Whom have I attempted to "tear down"?

I've merely said that this competition format has nothing to offer and training for it is a waste of my time. If you enjoy it and medals are important, by all means go and collect some. Get your reward. I find working with skilled people cooperatively to be far more beneficial. YMMV.

Once again, all of the judgment and tearing down is coming from one, to borrow a term "side" of some imagined argument that you seem unable to let go of.

I don't care about you or your training I don't understand why you're so obsessed with me.

I mean I'm flattered, but again, I'm sure there's far more interesting and productive conversation to be had than your schoolyard taunts.

Why not make your own case? Why do you think a ref and rules and a trinket is important?
It don't mean a thing, if it ain't got that jing.
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Re: Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

Postby cloudz on Tue May 03, 2022 7:30 am

my gripe is a small nuance in what you say
there's an important difference in saying:

it has nothing to offer and nothing to offer me.
the second is a personal judgement, subjective and to do with you.
the former is an objective measure

this is why some things you say rock a certain boat.
objectively, it has something of value to offer..

speaking about myself, have no issue I can take it or leave it, having tried it 3 times already.
there may be an opportunity this year, that just leaves the motivation.
essentially personal markers, whether I can be bothered or not.

as you say, this can be done informally or better in class, and often I prefer that.
Last edited by cloudz on Tue May 03, 2022 7:31 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

Postby origami_itto on Tue May 03, 2022 12:37 pm

cloudz wrote:my gripe is a small nuance in what you say
there's an important difference in saying:

it has nothing to offer and nothing to offer me.
the second is a personal judgement, subjective and to do with you.
the former is an objective measure

this is why some things you say rock a certain boat.
objectively, it has something of value to offer..

speaking about myself, have no issue I can take it or leave it, having tried it 3 times already.
there may be an opportunity this year, that just leaves the motivation.
essentially personal markers, whether I can be bothered or not.

as you say, this can be done informally or better in class, and often I prefer that.

Thinking about it I'm not sure whether I think it's subjectively or objectively useless.

The problem I have with it is the specific limitations and motivations put it in a sort of uncanny valley bereft of good Taijiquan. It promotes a huge amount of aggression but removes some of the tools I would think I'd need to use to deal with that aggression.

My Taijiquan isn't good enough thus hobbled to deal with huge aggression. So if I'm training to win I'm going to compensate somehow with something other that Taijiquan.

I say shit or get off the pot. Have more clinical and controlled push hands for highlighting Taijiquan skills and then go fight.
It don't mean a thing, if it ain't got that jing.
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Re: Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

Postby everything on Tue May 03, 2022 2:41 pm

When I did judo randori, we could do it like “extended” PH.

It was relatively easy to use taiji in a “soft” but “not internal” way.

Similarly it was easy to use “real judo”.

However judo shiai due to rules requiring you to attack (makes no sense and there is no force to borrow if you stand there waiting for other person to move so you can “borrow”) make it hard to have “good judo”. This is, I suspect, why Olympians look like they are using brute force when if we did randori with them, they might look like Jigoro Kano handling us mere mortals.

To work “actual internal” is 500x harder still to me so requires starting at 0. This is why I’ve been saying do step one or step zero even if you don’t believe it.

If you define it as “even softer judo” or “kinda like judo” then it’s different.

You should be able to enter MOST grappling comp types.

Apples and Oranges.

Empty your cup.
Last edited by everything on Tue May 03, 2022 2:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

Postby windwalker on Tue May 03, 2022 6:31 pm

everything wrote:.

However judo shiai due to rules requiring you to attack (makes no sense and there is no force to borrow if you stand there waiting for other person to move so you can “borrow”) make it hard to have “good judo”. comp types.

.


:)

There is "always" force to borrow from

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Re: Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

Postby wayne hansen on Tue May 03, 2022 6:53 pm

What if that form of training only makes you less able to handle a real confrontation
Have any of you ever considered that
Maybe force against force is not the best way to handle a guy with a knife
Don't put power into the form let it naturally arise from the form
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Re: Tai Chi Push Hands Miciah Guglielmi 6 X National Champion Au

Postby everything on Tue May 03, 2022 7:36 pm

windwalker wrote:
everything wrote:.

However judo shiai due to rules requiring you to attack (makes no sense and there is no force to borrow if you stand there waiting for other person to move so you can “borrow”) make it hard to have “good judo”. comp types.

.


:)

There is "always" force to borrow from

Image


some day i'll improve enough from "soft" to "internal" borrowing ...
Last edited by everything on Tue May 03, 2022 7:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
amateur practices til gets right pro til can't get wrong
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