structure - no-structure. peng jin

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Re: structure - no-structure. peng jin

Postby windwalker on Sun Oct 30, 2022 8:13 am

And as an aside, as far as I can tell neither Mizner nor Liang use the word 'structure' at all in their respective videos here.


:)



https://youtube.com/clip/Ugkx5P_X6_YKgw ... ExaNtVT2Gt
9:53

"the structure of your upper and lower body is not good"

Whether the word was used or not, they did use it, :)
Would've thought that most understood that structure was/is intrinsic to what the concepts demoed...

Part of what the thread /post was about...different uses of it according to level of understanding.
Not as in correct or not, some alluded to....
tend to think of it as "different" reflected in different levels of understanding, methods and training.

Which depending on the understanding and training will tend develop and enhance the aspects
of which the difference focus on...
Last edited by windwalker on Sun Oct 30, 2022 8:24 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: structure - no-structure. peng jin

Postby Giles on Sun Oct 30, 2022 1:26 pm

Your are right, he does use the term "structure". I stand corrected. In fact he uses 'structure' as a neutral term here, in the sense that it can either be not good or, by clear implication in what he says, can also be good. But really I will agree with Origami's remark that it's unproductive for anyone, and certainly also me, to get excessively hung up on a particular piece of terminology. My bad, I guess.

Sure, Windwalker, you are the one who started the thread so in that sense it's 'yours'. Doesn't mean I can't take issue with your use of terminology - it's an RSF thread, I'm not hacking into your website. ;) But otherwise, as stated above. And with respect to your statement that those with a level of understanding lower than yours - e.g. myself - just can't get it... Okay, happy to step aside now. :)
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Re: structure - no-structure. peng jin

Postby origami_itto on Sun Oct 30, 2022 2:53 pm

Giles wrote:Your are right, he does use the term "structure". I stand corrected. In fact he uses 'structure' as a neutral term here, in the sense that it can either be not good or, by clear implication in what he says, can also be good. But really I will agree with Origami's remark that it's unproductive for anyone, and certainly also me, to get excessively hung up on a particular piece of terminology. My bad, I guess.

Sure, Windwalker, you are the one who started the thread so in that sense it's 'yours'. Doesn't mean I can't take issue with your use of terminology - it's an RSF thread, I'm not hacking into your website. ;) But otherwise, as stated above. And with respect to your statement that those with a level of understanding lower than yours - e.g. myself - just can't get it... Okay, happy to step aside now. :)


That's just his windyness. It's endemic with we kung fu types.

If I were to try to put it into words... It's like a string of pearls. When they try to push it, it just moves out of the way. In a fight situation, it only takes a tiny adjustment to take the power out of a strike or throw. The pearls move, the power is gone. Like pushing rope. Don't even have to physically visibly move. Each pearl can rotate independently to throw force off. The string can wiggle and move. Their power spent, we are full and do what we like, control, press against to cause tension we can use to throw them out, whatever.

But that's not like "IT", that's just one part. I think another mistake we make is talking about one thing like it's everything and then trying to reconcile that with something else that we try to make everything. It's like, no, this is this one thing for this one purpose and context. Other things are different.

Maybe refined force really is the true goal. It sure seems like it lately.
It don't mean a thing, if it ain't got that jing.
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Re: structure - no-structure. peng jin

Postby windwalker on Sun Oct 30, 2022 3:52 pm

Giles wrote:Sure, Windwalker, you are the one who started the thread so in that sense it's 'yours'. Doesn't mean I can't take issue with your use of terminology - it's an RSF thread, I'm not hacking into your website. ;) But otherwise, as stated above. And with respect to your statement that those with a level of understanding lower than yours - e.g. myself - just can't get it... Okay, happy to step aside now. :)



Understanding with those I've worked with In China, meant either skill or experience. ie one might not have the skill set of their experience
but do have an understanding of the why and what they need to work on...to gain the skill

Found those with an understanding gained by experience often
have a wide latitude with which to view things through.

allowing one to realize the comparison is with themselves....not with others....
took a while for me to find this within myself....

Often remind those I work with, they already have "it"
Just need to let what they think "it" is go....

Doesn't mean I can't take issue with your use of terminology -


;D not mine, the usage comes from experience with others who have a high level of skill,,,
in a rather specific skill set I find interesting,,,

Like Adam's work and his teacher among other's
They all share the same skill sets, having a lot commonality in their descriptions of it..
It's quite interesting....
Last edited by windwalker on Sun Oct 30, 2022 4:44 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: structure - no-structure. peng jin

Postby windwalker on Sun Oct 30, 2022 5:31 pm


Google translate :)

汪永泉授楊式太極拳語錄及拳照
Wang Yongquan Writings on Yang Style Tai Chi Chuan


要虛心向前輩及取得了正確進展的同輩和晚輩請教,反复練習。切忌從拳論中片面摘出與自己 想法相近的只言片語,一意孤行地傻練,這樣做必出偏差,輕則功夫不能得到正確發展,重則 損傷身體。

We should humbly ask our seniors, peers and juniors who have made the right progress, and practice repeatedly.

Don't unilaterally extract from the boxing theory a few words and phrases that are similar to your own thoughts, and practice foolishly in one's own way.

Doing so will lead to deviations, and the kung fu will not develop correctly, the body will be damaged at worst.



felt it kind of resonated with some of posts.
Last edited by windwalker on Sun Oct 30, 2022 5:41 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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