James Wing Woo Tai Chi

[bigphatwong]

One of the last living "old timers". I admire his detailed approach to instruction.




Does anyone happen to know where his Tai Chi comes from? (Please don't say China ) I'm assuming it's some variant of Southern Yang style...

[shawnsegler]

Jess did a whole chapter on him in "neijaquan".

You could probably ask him.

S

[JessOBrien]

Yeah Sifu Woo is a maniac about the physical mechanics of the human body. Never met anyone as hungry and fascinated with it's every detailed function, from muscles, bones, ligaments, all that stuff. He's about 85 now and still pores over textbooks and anatomical charts.

His teacher was a student/contemporary of Chen Wei Ming in Canton before the war. Sifu Woo attended one of Yang Cheng Fu's last public seminars there and followed the form, as a youth.

Anyone who likes Tai Chi in the LA area, Sifu Woo is a treasure trove of knowledge.

www.jameswingwoo.com

Jess O

[bigphatwong]

Awesome... I have a translation of Chen Wei Ming's book and it is full of practical pointers. Thanks Jess!

[pete]

check out 'Secrets of Chinese Karate' by Ed Parker from the early '60s. Apparently, James Wing Woo was teaching Tai Chi and some 5 Animals/Hung Ga at Parkers Pasadena school and provided the material for the book and received no credit for it. So he left Parker. Several (most if not all) of Parkers advanced students followed Woo to continue training with him, including Parker's first black belt James Ibrao, who is now in his 70's and continues to take his weekly lesson with Woo.

[C.J.Wang]

It's rare to find a Chinese Taiji teacher his generation who is able to communicate in English so fluently.

[JessOBrien]

pete, yeah Secrets of Chinese Karate uses drawings that were made from photos of Sifu Woo as a much younger man...

CJ, Sifu Woo was born in the US, his father was a Tong leader and the family returned to southern China when Woo was a boy. So he is a Chinese American and was able to join the US Army in WWII rather than the KMT.

He still keeps an ROC flag on his desk. Very interesting life story!

Jess O

[bigphatwong]

Wow, that is so interesting! "Secrets of Chinese Karate" was one of the first handouts we got when training at the Institute. I had no idea that was supposed to be Sifu Woo in the illustrations.

Also, what the deal with his "Wing Woo Gar" Kung Fu that he teaches? Is it basically Hung Gar, or a combination of different things?

[JessOBrien]

Wing Woo Gar is a distillation of many different martial arts that Sifu Woo learned.
There are 10 basic punches, lines of kicks, combinations, foot work patterns, warm up exercises, stretches etc.
Then there are numerous forms, weapons, two person forms, chi kung etc. But that stuff is only rarely taught, his focus is on basic moving and punching.
All is done in a concrete floor waxed to extreme slipperyness in tai chi slippers. No sparring.

Influences include Hung Gar, Southern Praying Mantis, Mok Gar, Li Gar, Choy Gar, Choy Li Fut, Fut Gar, Eagle Claw, Northern Shaolin (he studied at Jing Woo in Canton), western boxing, and all three of the internal styles, as well as other systems, and systems unheard of in the west, likely even gone from China such as Lin Wan Quen, that he mentions in the interview I did with him. However, Sifu Woo is no fan of Wing Chun.

Sifu Woo is really a one of a kind guy, with a deep knowledge of Chinese martial arts. His Wing Woo Gar is a concise and complete collection of some of the best training Chinese kung fu has to offer. Unfortunately he only has a few students who've gone on to teach. I met some guys in his class that have been there since the early 1960's when they split from Parker, and they still train.

Jess O

[bigphatwong]

Jess,

that sounds fascinating, I'd love to learn from him someday if I get the chance. He and Jiang Hao Quan would be my top choices if I'm ever back in the L.A. area. Both men are living encyclopedias of CMA.

cheers,

Jules

[Andy_S]

Really good detailed instruction (though possibly overwhelming for a beginner). Remarkable that he has had students who have been with him for 30 plus years - what a treasure house. And indeed: Excellent English.

I am rather surprised that he is not better known/higher profile in the US CMA community.

[JoseFreitas]

Yes, especially considering that he basically created, or helped create, most of the American Kempo forms that are still practiced today (I will confess to liking some of them, in a "they're like, totallly cool, dude!" way). They have this basic southern chinese shape, but they're clearly mixed with a different of other flavours.

Jess, I really liked your book, by the way.

[Bao]

Really good detailed instruction (though possibly overwhelming for a beginner)

If you don't care about your wallet, I think it's an excellent approach, as along as you don't give to many movements at once. I think this kind of approach will at once sort out the people who wants easy light-weight taiji. The people interested in really learning and become good will stick with him as long as they can.

I know just about nothing about this guy. So the question I have is: How good is the martial side of his taiji?

edit: okej, I read the post about "complete chinese kung-fu". What I am interested in is to here more about his Taiji as martial art.

[JessOBrien]

Thanks Jose, I'm glad you liked it. Was an honor to speak with some great teachers who were surprisingly forthcoming.

Bao, that's an interesting question. Sifu Woo is from an old school mentality, which is rife with strange contradictions.

When we talk about Taiji as a martial art it seems that everyone has a different idea of what that means. Sifu Woo was involved in Tong activities in southern China as well as SF Chinatown as a young man. He told me about streetfights with weapons where people were severely injured. He was also involved with WWII. I'm not sure if he saw action or not, but that made a mark on his approach to the meaning of martial art.

He learned boxing in the US Navy, and is a lifelong fight fan who never misses a big prizefight. So he is not unfamiliar with sport fighting. Yet he never teaches sparring nor does he recommend it.

He has a deep hatred of 1,2,3 applications and techniques, and considers that to be a disgrace. After all no one is going to let you do that to them in reality. He says it simplifies the chaos of combat and gives people a phoney confidence that is counter productive to self-defense.

As he said in my book, his idea of training if to be used after midnight when you get hit in the back with a 2/4 at the gas station. In other words, when you have to fight at the worst possible time, with the worst odds, when you are totally unprepared.

His idea of training Tai Chi for combat is to discard unrealistic applications and play fighting like sparring, and to devote all resources to an extremely deep level of mechanical understanding of anatomy and body mechanics. In his view, this trains you to function under pressure. From some of his senior students that I've trained with, this method seems to work quite well. However, they had lots of real life fighting experience as well.

I found it interesting that almost without exception, the WWII veterans and survivors of extreme violence that I've met in the CMA world all reject sparring as a waste of time.

Not sure that I agree with them, but I have to take their life experience into account, and take their word for it.

When I finished writing my book I came to the conclusion that Chinese Martial Arts contain so many diverse and opposite perspectives that there is no way to define or explain it totally. As an "art" form, CMA is beyond categories and definitions. I can't make heads or tails of it anymore, I just train and have fun.

Sincerely,

Jess O

[Bao]

Thanks Jess,

very interesting indeed. Seems like a sound approach. Reminds me about one of my taiji teachers. Not much sparring or 1-2-3 apps either. But he is one of the best fighters I met.

Thanks again