The problem with Newaza in Judo

[Kurt Robbins]

The Referees really call it quick on the ground. - Also in the tournaments I've seen as well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CanWJ7g-5ME&NR=1

[Kurt Robbins]

An example of some Judo schools Newaza:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IoWmHpXMUZs&NR=1
I know there are some really good Judo schools with great ground skills, especially in Japan. I just found this interesting and matches my limited experiance with ONE schools Newaza. I love Judo's throws and wish tournaments would give more attention to ground work.

[CaliG]

Yeah, most judo schools don't really go into the technical aspects of ground work, then again most bjj schools don't really go into great detail about throws.

That's why I always try to train both (even if it's just a little bit). Because I want the complete package. Besides it is basically the same stuff just from a different position.

To me being good at both would be ideal, like this guy.




Some judoka used to look down on bjj as half of judo but now but not most realize that ground work can be just technical and infinite as stand up judo.

At the judo school I go to I help some of the new guys with their ground work. I always tell them that in class never give up your back and turtle up, in a judo competition it's okay but every other context it's a bad habit and even worse a waste of valuable training time unfortunately though due to judo rules of stopping the match when there's no action that's the technique that most judoka turn to when they are in a bad position on the ground.

[Jeice]

"Some judoka used to look down on bjj as half of judo"
Yeah... the other half, y'know, the one they trained too before the olympic ruleset came out. Kosen Judo anyone?

[CaliG]

I've heard that judo has changed a lot since becoming an Olympic sport. Before did guys do more newawa?

Also what exactly is Kosen judo? Is it competition judo?

[Finny]

Kosen judo (高專柔道) is the name given to the Kodokan Judo practiced at kosen schools in Japan at the turn of the 20th century. Their training is famous for grappling and wrestling techniques. It is also called "newaza Judo."

Ground-focused judo, basically

[wiesiek]

News about a lack of newaza skills in judo is kinda strange for me.
Average 50% tournament fights was / and probably IS/ win by some of newaza teh.
so
In my dojo we spended lot of training time doing newaza only.
and
we never trained pulling into newaza from standing /like sambo or BJJ , "classical"JJ has no more pulling on the ground than "my" judo/
or
worse lie on back, and try cach/pull into newaza, like on 1st. Kurt`s vid.

You have to do throw THEN go into newaza
but
my judo is from `70 past century
so, mayby I`m old school?

[Kurt Robbins]

Kosen Judo
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 9663208456
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 1&q=&hl=en

Me Likey

[Fubo]

My Judo school also does a lot of ground work. I think the amount of time you're allowed to spend on the ground is as much dependant on the rules as in the judge you get - IME most good judges will let you work for a little while on the ground if it looks like you are actively working towards a pin or submission. I do have to say that I like the rule set of Judo competition as it keeps the focus on trying to work your throws, but if someone wants to fight with rules that favor more mat work, theres always bjj comps.

The white belt bjj vs black belt Judo vid above is not a good example of black belt level Judo newaza - at least not from my school, and I have trained bjj.

[DeusTrismegistus]

In some of the videos I don't know how someone could even get a pin. My understanding was you could get an ippon by pinning your opponent for 30 seconds. The refs were calling it when a person was basically pinned but in like 5-10 seconds.

[Kurt Robbins]

I don't want to see Bjj take over Judo tournaments.
I am taking the side of a hybrid like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B6eImETD ... re=related

[Fubo]

Good Judo is a "hybrid", as it should contain both good stand-up and ground.

[Jeice]

Good Judo is a "hybrid", as it should contain both good stand-up and ground.

Good "grappling" should contain both stand-up and ground.

[wiesiek]

let`s agree
that
good school of MA should contain both stand-up and ground.

PS
I personally preffer stand-up ,
`cause i was fighting on the ground only once/ from ~~over 20 "off the dojo" encounters//
but
at the present times much more peoples train different MAs styles then in my childhood,
so
more knowledge/body abilitys is allways a+

edit.
Deus : if u score 1/2 ippon, ie:-wazari , u have to keep osajkomi 20sec. to win the fight /30 sec. if u account is empty/.
however it was years ago
mayby right now judo has different sets of rules?
i don`t know
Somebody who started in contemporary judo tournament may enlight us ?

[Fubo]

Good Judo is a "hybrid", as it should contain both good stand-up and ground.

Good "grappling" should contain both stand-up and ground.

That's what I kind of meant, but since I was replying to a post about Judo, I said Judo. But yes, I too believe all good grappling should have both.