What kind of diet are you following?

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What kind of diet are you following?

Postby everything on Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:10 pm

What kind of diet do you eat? Any specific guidelines you follow?

For me, the closer I get to eating more vegetables, the better I feel.

Which is kind of duh. Every mother, doctor, and mainstream healthy diet recommends vegetables. The longest lived humans eat whole foods including lots of veggies.

I haven't eliminated processed oil, meat, processed foods, grains, sugar, but trying to cut back over time.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby roger hao on Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:21 pm

Not eating pork or beef.
Eating chicken and starting to feel like one
Shrim / salmon
Turkey
Eggs
Water / fruit juice / coffee / coco water
Alkaline
Pasta / Rice / Potato
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby everything on Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:26 pm

Is that a high animal protein type diet?

I cut out beef and pork but kinda added back pork.

I think it was a mistake. Bacon is delicious haha
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby Peacedog on Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:39 pm

For purposes of controlling bodyfat levels I've really only seen three approaches work long term: intermittent fasting, low carbohydrate and ketogenic. And ketogenic I can really only recommend for people with difficulty controlling epilepsy and some autoimmune problems.

All of this really hinges on carbohydrate restriction. The good news is most people only needs to cut this back a little. The bad news is some people have to be really restrictive. At present it is all trial and error. We don't have any reliable testing on who falls where in that spectrum.

As for what causes people to develop issues with carbohydrates the real answer is no one knows. My bet is on gut bionome issues, but it is early days in that science and it is anyone's guess as to which bacteria are better for health long term let alone the mix that is controlling this phenomena.

A few tricks exist, such as a carbohydrate refeeding either one meal or one day per week. This tends to help prevent endocrine downregulation as a result of long term carbohydrate restriction. But the truth is damned if you do/damned if you don't assuming you have trouble with your bodyfat levels in the first place.

As for all of the food type restrictive diets (vegetarianism, carnivore diet, pescatarianism, fruitinarian, etc.) they end up creating weird deficiencies over the long run in my experience. The reality is human beings are omnivores and many groups are just plain delusional about this.

A rough guide to nutrition is: protein provides the material to build tissue with, animal fats power the endocrine system/provide energy, and carbohydrate provides both cheap and fast energy/throws the insulin switch for anabolism to make the body build tissue using protein. Animal protein is far more efficient for building tissue than plant sources, animal fats contain the right ratio of Omega series fats and various micronutrients to power the endocrine system, and plants provide the micronutrients that animal fats don't.

The only advice I would give people whose bodyfat levels are in check is to eat plenty of lower carb vegetables, more organ meats excepting animal brains (due to the risk of prion based disease), and to avoid processed carbohydrates in particular. Ideally for strength purposes this works out to roughly 2.2g of animal protein per kilogram of body weight/ 1 gram of protein per pound of bodyweight per day for an adult male. Women would be a little less. Be careful with larger fish species due to potential mercury content.

Personally, I follow a generally low carbohydrate diet with occasional round of intermittent fasting when on diet.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby everything on Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:02 pm

I don't know if that's how Japanese women eat (base of rice). There is currently some argument for high carb, low fat, no animal products, no processed foods including vegetable oil. So it would be something like:

- plenty of rice
- starchy vegetables like sweet potatoes
- other green vegetables
- legumes (such as tofu - fermentation is supposedly good)
- very little fruit
- maybe a tiny amount of meat or fish
- no dairy
- no or limited eggs
- no processed sugars
- no or limited processed oils
- no processed foods at all if possible

So this is also mostly how Japanese women probably eat. Since that is a very large base over a very long time with the highest life expectancy, there seems to be something to this. I trust this data set over the short-term studies/fads. On the opposite extreme, bodybuilders consume too much protein. Their diet is incredible for muscle mass and low fat (with the right exercise), but there is likely too much stress on organs such as liver and kidneys to do that over a long time.

Personally I used to eat too much meat and junk food. Slowly cutting that back.
Last edited by everything on Wed Nov 07, 2018 5:04 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby Peacedog on Wed Nov 07, 2018 6:31 pm

Most Japanese essentially eat a calorie restricted when following the diet you've outlined. Severely restricting caloric intake has been shown to increase lifespan for all mammals. Of course, adherence is tricky and comes with multiple downsides. Mostly in the form of fertility when younger and being fairly weak when older.

FYI, the recent spat of liver and kidney failure amongst bodybuilders is largely due to the incredible quantity of drugs they are on. A friend is an IFBB card holder and the quantity of gear they run is staggering. The use of diuretics in particular has been behind a lot of the kidney damage we are seeing today.

The Soviet studies on protein intake and athletes showed no downside as long as the use of anabolics was limited. Some of these are available in books like Supertraining by Verkhoshansky. It is of particular interest as most nutritional research in the modern era is crap. A lot of reasons exist for this, but one of the primary one involves the fact that any definitive study would be deemed unethical and probably be cost prohibitive as well.

To do these properly, you would need to keep people in a locked down compound where you can control everything they eat for years at a time. Which is what the Soviets did. And it is also why this research will never be repeated.

Outside of this, researchers have to rely upon what participants report in terms of their diet or on very short term studies. Neither of which give much in the way of useful information. One because people lie, particularly about what they eat. And two, because the duration is too short.

And none of this takes into consideration studies simply being falsified by people with an agenda or poor study design. I've yet to see any study linking meat consumption and things like cancer that controlled for carbohydrate consumption. Because we know obesity is linked with certain forms of cancer.

On the other hand, we know that vegetarian diets in general, and vegan diets in particular, require a pharmaceutical level intervention using supplementary vitamin B-12 to avoid causing neurological (i.e. brain) damage over the long term. These diets are also very low in protein and critically low in things like iron, zinc, calcium, etc. And these are just the things we know about. Supplementation can help with this. But relying upon that long term seems to be a work around more than a good idea.

Three decent population level studies were performed in the last two decades on diet and health. One by the NIH in US, the National Health in the UK and a third one by a leading university in Austria. All three reported the same finding. Vegetarians in general, and vegans in particular, all over represented in terms of every major category of disease and they significantly over represented in the category of mental illness. Now, again, this could simply be that sick people are attracted to diets limited in meat.

I've left a link to the Austrian study. The NIH and National Health reports are behind paywalls.

https://journals.plos.org/plosone/artic ... =printable

The point I'm trying to make is that without a specific issue needing dietary restriction (i.e. epilepsy, autoimmune or allergy related) as omnivores human beings should eat a varied diet. I don't think it's a stretch to advise limiting the intake of highly processed foods simply based off of their unnaturally calorically dense and chemical laden nature. And I count most grains, particularly processed grains, in the same category as they simply haven't been available in the human diet long enough for most ethnic groups to have developed a good ability to handle them.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby edededed on Wed Nov 07, 2018 6:48 pm

I wonder how the vegetarians in China managed - one of my teacher's Shaolin teachers apparently had no meat (or even eggs, milk) his whole life. Perhaps they have some dietary guidelines of some sort that manage the nutrition deficiencies.

Anyway, Japanese women's diet now looks more like:

- plenty of rice (white rice)
- starchy vegetables like sweet potatoes
- other green vegetables
- legumes (such as tofu - fermentation is supposedly good)
- lots of fruit (grapes, peaches, strawberries, mangos, etc.)
- meat and/or fish (restricted by cost - beef is considered expensive)
- dairy (especially in coffee/tea and sweets)
- eggs (both cooked or raw)
- lots of processed sugars (almost all cooking includes white sugar in it, not to mention all the sweets)
- any oils, including processed oils
- lots of processed foods (white rice, white bread is ubiquitous; brown rice and whole-wheat are very rare)

But as Peacedog said, the total calories are less, mostly due to everything being smaller. (Imagine if all restaurants only gave kids' portions.)
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby everything on Wed Nov 07, 2018 7:23 pm

they need to keep everything but the dairy, oils, sweets, processed foods, too much fruit, haha.

if eating like these 80somethings, that's probably better:
https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyl ... ional-diet
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby Peacedog on Wed Nov 07, 2018 9:40 pm

I would also add the very real possibility that certain ethnic groups have genetically adapted themselves to agriculturally produced crops/foods by virtue of having eaten them for thousands of years and that people from outside of those groups will probably have issues with it...

Examples would include the Japanese/southern Chinese to rice. People of Mesopotamian descent to wheat. People from central Mexico up through the American southwest to corn. People from the Andes to potatoes. Northern Europeans can generally handle milk products, etc.

I think advances in genetic testing will reveal a lot of this over the next 20-30 years. We just aren't quite there yet.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby Trick on Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:11 am

Pizza, burgers and fries……………………………I like and eat now and then. But living in China for many years now I have come to eat more veggies and fruits and lesser meat but still eat an egg a day it’s a good source of vitamin B’s, and liver once or twice a week which also is packed with vitamins and minerals. I lived in Dalian before which is a city by the sea so seafood and fish filled my stomach more often there, where I live now Beef an chicken is the signature ……A tradition from Sweden I continue with here in China is a daily bowl of oatmeal porridge, it’s a must. Another must i have is three tomatoes a day - keeps colds away………I’ve noticed.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby wiesiek on Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:44 am

this is one of ours neverending topics...:)
and my shot is, as always:
dont`t mix in the 1st place! - sugars with proteins in one meal, /use tropology, dammed! ;)/
and drink 1-2 l freshly done vege/fruits juices a day.
I also recommend regular fastenings or day - >juices only < once a week - it helps establish your personal diet.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby everything on Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:03 am

well it's a never-ending interesting topic.

I think the wheat/rice/corn/potato/milk thing is true (but not proven) as well. So basically I bet I can digest and use rice well, but not the others as much. I feel good on a base of rice and green tea.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby Peacedog on Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:49 am

And that's the thing. If your blood markers are good and your bodyfat levels are in check, then I say eat whatever works for that.
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby edededed on Thu Nov 08, 2018 7:32 pm

It's quite clear for milk at least (people like me sometimes get gassy, it's not pretty!). But I wonder if the gut biome has a lot to do with it, too - my theory is that lactose, cold, etc. are factors that cause my gut microbes to start farting a lot :D

Another problem is when, for example, someone from Asia moves to the US and is raised on pies, mac & cheese, etc. Rice just doesn't taste good to that person!

In Japan, the older folks in Ryukyu areas (e.g. Okinawa or Amami) seem to have the best diets (traditional, unprocessed).
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Re: What kind of diet are you following?

Postby everything on Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:01 pm

It does sound like Okinawa has less junk food at least where the seniors are concerned.

I don't think wheat is great for me...
... but who doesn't love pizza??

One great thing about globalization and a smaller world is trying so many cuisines.

But East Asian and "Californian" seem to be best for me.
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