Dream learning

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Re: Dream learning

Postby JoeWood on Sun Nov 04, 2018 9:27 pm

I started lucid dreaming on accident. I am a very heavy sleeper and sometimes sleep thru my alarm clock so to help wake up in the morning I began drinking a couple of glasses of water before bed. Every so often I would wake up in the night to use the toilet, but all of a sudden after returning to bed to sleep one night the lucid dream kicked in. After a little bit of practice I have experienced some pretty neat stuff like what has been described as dream learning here, among other things. I haven't really used it with any specific objective, just enjoying the ride. I never thought to do a dream journal but I can see how it could be helpful if you're trying to initiate lucid dreams or are seeking a certain kind of experience. I'm at a point where I can usually get a lucid dream going if I try but mostly I just don't think about it. Sometimes I will feel a dream start to become lucid and keep the wool over my eyes so to speak.
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Trick on Mon Nov 05, 2018 1:06 am

Peacedog wrote:Trick,

The key step is writing down everything the second you wake up. This appears to short circuit some kind of auto-delete function in the human memory system.


Best of luck.

I will try to do that, need some discipline since in the middle of the night it feels most comfortable to just turn around and continue sleep(dream).……Something I noticed a long time ago is during full moons the dreaming is more vivid and clear so quite easy to remember after waking up
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Trick on Mon Nov 05, 2018 1:07 am

northern_mantis wrote:Cool stuff, nice to think that training doesn't stop with sleep. If I do energy work before bed I always get snake dreams and I fucking hate snakes! Weird because there is no cultural influence for this so who knows where it comes from. So no qigong before bed for me!

I usually do some simple Qigong’ish exercises and a short “quiet sitting” before bedtime. Haven’t seen any snakes yet 8-) but it might explain why I sometimes come to dream about my martial arts practice.
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Trick on Mon Nov 05, 2018 1:13 am

Bill wrote:Sigmund Freud saw a snake as a phallic symbol and so it may represent a male figure that you find sexually attractive or threatening, depending upon how you feel in the dream. 8-)

One can wonder what stuff Sigmund was in and on to 8-)
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Trick on Mon Nov 05, 2018 5:30 am

Trick wrote:
northern_mantis wrote:Cool stuff, nice to think that training doesn't stop with sleep. If I do energy work before bed I always get snake dreams and I fucking hate snakes! Weird because there is no cultural influence for this so who knows where it comes from. So no qigong before bed for me!

I usually do some simple Qigong’ish exercises and a short “quiet sitting” before bedtime. Haven’t seen any snakes yet 8-) but it might explain why I sometimes come to dream about my martial arts practice.

About snake deities - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nāga
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Steve James on Mon Nov 05, 2018 7:21 am

Well, visualization is a key tool in many sports where a pattern must be learned. There's a lot of fact in the statement "I could do it in my sleep." Studying the course is important to any motor or bike racers, for example. But, gymnasts and others can visualize their routines, see them in their sleep, and even see things they can't do ... yet. Sometimes, they might dream something up. ;)
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Re: Dream learning

Postby roger hao on Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:45 am

Fiction or not -
Carlos Castenada covered this in detail in his books that relate teachings of the Yaqui shaman
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Peacedog on Tue Nov 06, 2018 2:40 pm

Funny you mention Castenada. I once studied for a time with a cult leader in the American South West who claimed to have studied with Castenada's teacher.

He was an interesting guy. He kept trying to create a modern tribe that was always collapsing. Typical sex cult stuff on his end, but my only exposure to the Native American version of chi gung. The sweat lodge rituals were nice though.
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Re: Dream learning

Postby roger hao on Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:04 pm

Peacedog -
There was some major discredit that Carlos Castenada made the whole thing up.

What do you know about that?
There is a high degree of detail and some of the stuff works.
For example -
Gait of power
Looking at the hands to instantiate control in the dream
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Franklin on Tue Nov 06, 2018 5:33 pm

Peacedog wrote:Funny you mention Castenada. I once studied for a time with a cult leader in the American South West who claimed to have studied with Castenada's teacher.

He was an interesting guy. He kept trying to create a modern tribe that was always collapsing. Typical sex cult stuff on his end, but my only exposure to the Native American version of chi gung. The sweat lodge rituals were nice though.



did it look something like this (the qigong)?

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Re: Dream learning

Postby Peacedog on Wed Nov 07, 2018 6:10 am

Franklin,

Parts of it look vaguely familiar. Even the demo video looks culty. Weird. Creepy.


Roger,

As for the individual in particular and Castanada's teacher, it's really hard to say. Cult leaders are not known for their reliability and I didn't get that far into it before I decided my attention was best focused elsewhere. I went to a few of their weekend retreats and one multi-day training camp. Once I started to hear all of the stories about "sexual healing" involving the cult's wives, I hit the road and didn't look back.

That said, the guy had something and that has typically been my experience with cult leaders over the years. I'm not saying there was any high level of ability there, just that the guy had cultivated to a degree. Now the nature of his relationship with Castenada's lineage, etc. I'll never know.

What I can say was that the system he espoused worked pretty exclusively with solar/heavenly energy and viewed earth energy as "evil." This led to some pretty weird energetics and behavior on the part of many of the group's members over time. I always viewed that as an imbalanced approach. Now how much of that was from actual Native American practice, I can't say.
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Trick on Thu Nov 08, 2018 2:13 am

Peacedog wrote:Franklin,

Parts of it look vaguely familiar. Even the demo video looks culty. Weird. Creepy.


Roger,

As for the individual in particular and Castanada's teacher, it's really hard to say. Cult leaders are not known for their reliability and I didn't get that far into it before I decided my attention was best focused elsewhere. I went to a few of their weekend retreats and one multi-day training camp. Once I started to hear all of the stories about "sexual healing" involving the cult's wives, I hit the road and didn't look back.

That said, the guy had something and that has typically been my experience with cult leaders over the years. I'm not saying there was any high level of ability there, just that the guy had cultivated to a degree. Now the nature of his relationship with Castenada's lineage, etc. I'll never know.

What I can say was that the system he espoused worked pretty exclusively with solar/heavenly energy and viewed earth energy as "evil." This led to some pretty weird energetics and behavior on the part of many of the group's members over time. I always viewed that as an imbalanced approach. Now how much of that was from actual Native American practice, I can't say.

Castaneda was a Peruvian? and probably somewhat inspired by the Inka’s sun worshiping which in that sense also falls in line with Christianity and even more ancient religions. The sun was/is a light and life giver.……About worshipping earthly things being bad, we can look to some supposed esoteric beliefs of WW2 Nazi’s that involve “the black sun” which supposedly is the inner core of the earth - the underworld.……But then the earths inner core gives the magnetic field that protect us from dangerous cosmic/solar radiation
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Re: Dream learning

Postby wiesiek on Thu Nov 08, 2018 4:21 am

As I recall my dreamin` experience, there is few of them so intensive , that I remember them sharp.
In one , I was renegade from the secret sect chasing by 9 former 'brothers".
They got me on the end, and slashed on pieces during heavy swords fight .
What`s really interesting - I woke up with severe pain in the areas where I was cut,
+ why they come in number of the 9?
`cause I was 8 direction sword Disciple, they needed 9th sword to get me from "unguarded" side...,
kind of the funny thing, but I get this info directly in the dream.

Speakin` about learning thru dreamin` or better "conscious dreaming" - as Peacedog noted - Tibetans has the best "how to" books .

.
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Re: Dream learning

Postby Trick on Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:27 am

wiesiek wrote:As I recall my dreamin` experience, there is few of them so intensive , that I remember them sharp.
In one , I was renegade from the secret sect chasing by 9 former 'brothers".
They got me on the end, and slashed on pieces during heavy swords fight .
What`s really interesting - I woke up with severe pain in the areas where I was cut,
+ why they come in number of the 9?
`cause I was 8 direction sword Disciple, they needed 9th sword to get me from "unguarded" side...,
kind of the funny thing, but I get this info directly in the dream.

Speakin` about learning thru dreamin` or better "conscious dreaming" - as Peacedog noted - Tibetans has the best "how to" books .

.

That’s quite an interesting action dream with having the bruises from the dream for real. I punched a wall just beside the bed once when dreaming being in a fight, not really painful but the fist on wall impact made me wake up.……As you say some dreams are so clear they remain as real memories, and as I’ve noticed long time ago dreams during full moon times are especially clear and vivid.
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Re: Dream learning

Postby TrainingDummy on Sat Nov 10, 2018 1:19 pm

I liked Tenzin Wangyal Rinpoche's book on dreaming in the Tibetan tradition.

https://www.amazon.com/Tibetan-Yogas-Dr ... 1559391014

I've also recently had great success with my dream practice by incorporating the chapter on dreaming from the A Khrid manual in Bon Dzogschen. It's a great text, but probably requires personal instruction to decipher.

https://www.amazon.com/Pith-Instruction ... 0986282650
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