Genesis 1. In the beginning.

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Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby GrahamB on Wed May 22, 2019 1:52 am

No, not Phil Collins and Peter Gabriel, the other Genesis.

I know you rumsoakedfistians have been patiently waiting for somebody to explain how Genesis relates to Chinese martial arts (and Baguazhang in particular).

Well, here it is! The first chapter of your Heretical Bible:

https://www.hereticspodcast.com/2019/05 ... genesis-i/
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Trick on Wed May 22, 2019 2:48 am

Gather the firework, raise the stakes and light the torches. Heresy ahead
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby GrahamB on Wed May 22, 2019 2:50 am

Time to put the tin hats on!
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Appledog on Wed May 22, 2019 12:07 pm

I've listened to six or so of the History of Xingyi podcasts, despite none of them having anything to do (at all) with xingyi -- even into the foreseeable future. Mainly because as an east asian studies minor I am interested in Chinese history, generally speaking. But this? Come on, most of the theories your passing around in this podcast have been discredited for over 100 years... it's so bad actually that I'd advise you take it down because it's essentially misinformation. I know it pays to be controversial but this one was a little too thin on facts to be credibly contentious. I like what your doing I am just getting a little frustrated at the endless mulberry bush I am being presented with.

Can you guys please do a podcast on the actual history of xingyi please? I mean I don't want you to do something that's not your style, but after six hours I was hoping to get something about actually xingyi and not a diversion into the bible (which no offence you completely butchered :))
Last edited by Appledog on Wed May 22, 2019 12:23 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby GrahamB on Wed May 22, 2019 1:36 pm

Always nice to hear from your fan base ;D

The Xingyi series might be moving slowly, but I like to think we're giving a fuller picture of Chinese history that will all pay off later when it all connects on one glorious episode in the future. It'll be a bigger payoff than the whole Hodor thing in Game of Thrones.

You need to understand the history to really understand what happened later. I understand the frustration with how long it's taking, but if you just want to the standard vanilla version of XY history just go and look at a webpage. It's usually all summed up in 4 paragraphs.

Anyway, it's made watching Marco Polo on Netflix more fun for me because I know who all these guys are and what their history is ;)
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Trick on Fri May 24, 2019 2:41 am

Appledog wrote:I've listened to six or so of the History of Xingyi podcasts, despite none of them having anything to do (at all) with xingyi -- even into the foreseeable future. Mainly because as an east asian studies minor I am interested in Chinese history, generally speaking. But this? Come on, most of the theories your passing around in this podcast have been discredited for over 100 years... it's so bad actually that I'd advise you take it down because it's essentially misinformation. I know it pays to be controversial but this one was a little too thin on facts to be credibly contentious. I like what your doing I am just getting a little frustrated at the endless mulberry bush I am being presented with.

Can you guys please do a podcast on the actual history of xingyi please? I mean I don't want you to do something that's not your style, but after six hours I was hoping to get something about actually xingyi and not a diversion into the bible (which no offence you completely butchered :))

How have you time to listen through it all ? .....I have not had the time on hands to listen through any of the podcast so I don’t know about it’s seriousness, but I suspect it’s all on the lighter side.....or maybe not since there are so many hours of supposed heresy ? 8-)
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Appledog on Fri May 24, 2019 9:29 am

Trick wrote:
Appledog wrote:I've listened to six or so of the History of Xingyi podcasts, despite none of them having anything to do (at all) with xingyi -- even into the foreseeable future. Mainly because as an east asian studies minor I am interested in Chinese history, generally speaking. But this? Come on, most of the theories your passing around in this podcast have been discredited for over 100 years... it's so bad actually that I'd advise you take it down because it's essentially misinformation. I know it pays to be controversial but this one was a little too thin on facts to be credibly contentious. I like what your doing I am just getting a little frustrated at the endless mulberry bush I am being presented with.

Can you guys please do a podcast on the actual history of xingyi please? I mean I don't want you to do something that's not your style, but after six hours I was hoping to get something about actually xingyi and not a diversion into the bible (which no offence you completely butchered :))

How have you time to listen through it all ? .....I have not had the time on hands to listen through any of the podcast so I don’t know about it’s seriousness, but I suspect it’s all on the lighter side.....or maybe not since there are so many hours of supposed heresy ? 8-)


I usually listen to 2 or 3 hours of podcasts/music a day just while i'm out walking. Sometimes I also listen during stretching or just leave stuff playing while I'm doing other things. I save the important stuff for the walks though so I can pay attention to it. Stuff like Joe Rogan I just play whenever, like while I am working on the computer.
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Trick on Fri May 24, 2019 9:25 pm

Interesting that Marco Polo was mentioned. What is not very well known is that Marco Polo was not only a highly skilled pasta maker but also quite well versed in hand to hand combat, more specific in the martial art of Stav......So here’s the short story on the long journey of Stav, from its origin in ancient Scandinavia to the Mongol ruled China where it eventually became the foundation not only for XYQ but basically all Chinese hand to hand combat arts. But first, Stav here refers to the letters of the runic “alphabet” which shapes lay the basis for the outwardly postures practice, also the sounds of the runic letters play an important role here, it’s all highly Shamanic. But Stav in Scandinavian can also mean a staff(remember this). Well, here’s the story - A long long time ago groups of people from Götaland a region in today’s Sweden migrated southward and settled among the wild Germanic tribes in today’s Germany. They disciplined those wild men by teaching them the sophisticated martial art of Stav that their ancestors had created. Over time those Germanic tribes men became well disciplined warriors that eventually conquered Rome and its empire, they where The Goths......So eventually many Italians/(Venetians) are of gothic descendant and some of them kept the tradition of Stav, Marco Polo was one of them. During his adventurous travels to the Far East his knowledge in Stav saved him during dangerous encounters with bandits and hooligans. During his stay at the court of the Mongols and being well treated there he wanted to teach them the art of Stav, but the Mongols seemed to be more interesting in the warm up exercise Marco taught to them which where another more rough, simple and playful martial art that had also been handed down from those ancient people that once had migrated from Götaland, that martial art was the wrestling art called Glima......Marco eventually came to visit the Shaolin temple where he saw the monks despite that they where doing daily exercises(that they said were brought from India) where critically out of shape, he immediately decided to teach them Stav. After a couple of months the monks had grown strong and full of vigor. He also taught them how to make pasta which of course also played a role for the strength the monks had gained in such a short span of time. Being moved by the monks determination to learn he also explained to the monks the full history of Stav and the meaning of the name......But somewhere along the road later monks at the Shaolin got the meaning of the name Stav wrong. Or perhaps was it when the highly skilled spear master who battle tired entered the temple perhaps misinterpreted things and believed the sophisticated hand to hand combat he encountered the monks possessed had been developed from staff combat.......Anyway, from here on the spear master after leaving the Shaolin temple and set out to teach the martial art he had learned from the monks taught his students it was all based on how the staff/spear was used in combat, and he also made up the story of Yue-Fei being among the originators of it(anyway who would believe the story that it all originated in some ancient “fairyland” called Götaland) He also convinced the monks at the temple to follow his suggestions on that extremely altered history........Well, that’s it in short, that’s the history of XYQ and most of the martial arts of China and East-Asia for that matter. As you see it’s far away from the story many want to believe, that it all originated with Sinanju that were taught to Yue-Fei and then so on, so on.........................Take it or leave it 8-) .....There is of course also the possibility that Yue-Fei actually was an student of Marco Polo learning the art of noodle making and more................Another angle on how ancient Scandinavian(Swedish) martial arts came to China and flourish in the Middle Kingdom was by the means of the Kievan-Rus, or more exactly the “Ruser”. A people migrating from Götalands rival kingdom Svealand also called Roslagen there of their name Roser/Ruser...Yes you figured it out, the name of these people is to be found in the name of Russia...But all that is for another exciting martial arts history lesson 8-)
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby everything on Sat May 25, 2019 2:17 pm

wut
amateur practices til gets right pro til can't get wrong
/ better approx answer to right q than exact answer to wrong q which can be made precise /
“most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. Source of all true art & science
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Trick on Sat May 25, 2019 10:09 pm

Sound quite unbelievable and unrelated to XYQ ,doesn’t it !? 8-)
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Giles on Sun May 26, 2019 4:08 am

Good to hear the true inside story at last. Just to clarify the Shaolin spear aspect: Marco Polo’s signature pasta recipe involved tomato noodles, which of course have a reddish tinge. (Yes, I know tomatoes come from America, which hadn’t yet been discovered by Europeans, but the aliens who built those temples in the Americas also transferred a few seedling tomatoes to Marco, alright?). Anyway, Marco was always looking for ways of drying his freshly made noodles. His great idea was to affix a bunch of tomato-red noodles just below the spear point, so that all the spear shaking and sweeping during training helped to dry the noodles in no time. Sorted! However, as time went by, the Shaolin monks unfortunately lost the noodle recipe – such is entropy – but to continue the spear tradition, they substituted some red horsehair for the original pasta delight. And even today, a Chinese spear will always, symbolically, have some of Marco’s best tomato noodles under the head.
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby oragami_itto on Sun May 26, 2019 6:54 am

Giles wrote:Good to hear the true inside story at last. Just to clarify the Shaolin spear aspect: Marco Polo’s signature pasta recipe involved tomato noodles, which of course have a reddish tinge. (Yes, I know tomatoes come from America, which hadn’t yet been discovered by Europeans, but the aliens who built those temples in the Americas also transferred a few seedling tomatoes to Marco, alright?). Anyway, Marco was always looking for ways of drying his freshly made noodles. His great idea was to affix a bunch of tomato-red noodles just below the spear point, so that all the spear shaking and sweeping during training helped to dry the noodles in no time. Sorted! However, as time went by, the Shaolin monks unfortunately lost the noodle recipe – such is entropy – but to continue the spear tradition, they substituted some red horsehair for the original pasta delight. And even today, a Chinese spear will always, symbolically, have some of Marco’s best tomato noodles under the head.


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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby everything on Sun May 26, 2019 12:41 pm

so much stuff is making sense now
amateur practices til gets right pro til can't get wrong
/ better approx answer to right q than exact answer to wrong q which can be made precise /
“most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. Source of all true art & science
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Bill on Sun May 26, 2019 2:23 pm

This needs to be a movie. With Tom Cruise playing Marco Polo.
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Re: Genesis 1. In the beginning.

Postby Trick on Sun May 26, 2019 9:23 pm

everything wrote:so much stuff is making sense now

Everything ...........that you thought was the true history of CMA is fake history, but we are here to set it straight....
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