Hong Kong Protests

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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Ian on Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:19 am

windwalker wrote:HK is part of China


I literally just said the same.


What is it that some here expect not to happen or be protected from?


I already answered this.


China, regards all people of Chinese ethnicity to be part of it regardless of nationality.


Yes. And the British considered the American Thirteen Colonies to be part of the British Empire, and the Soviet Union considered Eastern Europe and Central Asia to be its territory.

If we followed that logic, Singapore, Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, and pieces of the United States and Canada would be part of China.
Last edited by Ian on Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:20 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Fubo on Wed Aug 07, 2019 9:20 am

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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby windwalker on Wed Aug 07, 2019 10:41 am

Ian wrote:
windwalker wrote:

Yes. And the British considered the American Thirteen Colonies to be part of the British Empire, and the Soviet Union considered Eastern Europe and Central Asia to be its territory.

If we followed that logic, Singapore, Thailand, Malaysia, Indonesia, and pieces of the United States and Canada would be part of China.


Good , a student of history but doesn't seem to understand how this achieved and why one has to have a good military.

lets focus on current events the present reality .


HK / mainland will work it out,,,
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Ian on Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:18 am

windwalker wrote:Good , a student of history but doesn't seem to understand how this achieved and why one has to have a good military.


You misunderstand; I'm not advocating HK independence.

I'm pointing out the irrelevance of your statement that "China, regards all people of Chinese ethnicity to be part of it regardless of nationality."

It's irrelevant because for the third time, HK is a part of China. The vast majority of HK citizens don't dispute that, as Beijing claims.

The protestors list five demands, they're quite succinct, and none of them are about independence. If you're interested, you can look them up.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby windwalker on Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:35 am

Ian wrote:
windwalker wrote:Good , a student of history but doesn't seem to understand how this achieved and why one has to have a good military.


You misunderstand; I'm not advocating HK independence.

I'm pointing out the irrelevance of your statement that "China, regards all people of Chinese ethnicity to be part of it regardless of nationality."

It's irrelevant because for the third time, HK is a part of China. The vast majority of HK citizens don't dispute that, as Beijing claims.


While true it would seem that some feel some how it is independent of itself...

The protestors list five demands, they're quite succinct, and none of them are about independence. If you're interested, you can look them up.


Indirectly they'er not...autonomy might be a better word....
don't see it happening and will become more apparent as time goes on.

Yep, looks like there was some misunderstanding on my part.

As some have noted a lot of factors that only the people there in power really understand

The truth of the matter is that, of the five demands, the government has responded to most, and has in fact taken a step back or two on some. Viewed in this light, it is fair to say the government has reached out a hand of conciliation. But reconciliation can only be achieved by both sides.

https://www.scmp.com/comment/opinion/ar ... carrie-lam

hope both sides come to some understanding
Last edited by windwalker on Wed Aug 07, 2019 2:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby grzegorz on Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:05 pm

Trick wrote:I got that from the MSM, which ones I have forgot now. And as I said most have forgotten although it was just a few year back.......So time to repeat and do “right” this time the Mericans think.....Ups!


Looking around it seems that the Russian "MSM" (ala RT) is suggesting that the CIA behind the Hong Kong protests.

Hardy credible if you ask me. If you recall RT was showing people fleeing voilence from Russians troops and stating that the people were fleeing Ukraine until those same people identified themselves as fleeing from the Russians.

Sorry but the CIA can't even handle Afghanistan, Iraq, North Korea, or Valenzuela. To think they somehow hit a homerun in HK is odd to me.

But what do I know?
Last edited by grzegorz on Wed Aug 07, 2019 11:07 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Trick on Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:42 am

grzegorz wrote:
Trick wrote:I got that from the MSM, which ones I have forgot now. And as I said most have forgotten although it was just a few year back.......So time to repeat and do “right” this time the Mericans think.....Ups!


Looking around it seems that the Russian "MSM" (ala RT) is suggesting that the CIA behind the Hong Kong protests.

Hardy credible if you ask me. If you recall RT was showing people fleeing voilence from Russians troops and stating that the people were fleeing Ukraine until those same people identified themselves as fleeing from the Russians.

Sorry but the CIA can't even handle Afghanistan, Iraq, North Korea, or Valenzuela. To think they somehow hit a homerun in HK is odd to me.

But what do I know?

Yes as I said the CIA didn’t have an success with the umbrella movement, so they try now again using the “extraction bill” to light a fire and pure oil on it.

And yes you are most probably right that CIA was/is involved in destabilizing plots to those countries you listed. But I actually think they think in those cases theirs involvements are going as planned.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Bao on Thu Aug 08, 2019 3:59 am

Trick wrote:Yes as I said the CIA didn’t have an success with the umbrella movement, so they try now again using the “extraction bill” to light a fire and pure oil on it.

And yes you are most probably right that CIA was/is involved in destabilizing plots to those countries you listed. But I actually think they think in those cases theirs involvements are going as planned.


It’s going more or less as planned. They don’t want HK to split with the Mainland. They want to stir up problems so that the Mainland can not focus on their internal business and their own development plans, making it going slower for them.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby grzegorz on Thu Aug 08, 2019 6:51 am

Trick wrote:
grzegorz wrote:
Trick wrote:I got that from the MSM, which ones I have forgot now. And as I said most have forgotten although it was just a few year back.......So time to repeat and do “right” this time the Mericans think.....Ups!


Looking around it seems that the Russian "MSM" (ala RT) is suggesting that the CIA behind the Hong Kong protests.

Hardy credible if you ask me. If you recall RT was showing people fleeing voilence from Russians troops and stating that the people were fleeing Ukraine until those same people identified themselves as fleeing from the Russians.

Sorry but the CIA can't even handle Afghanistan, Iraq, North Korea, or Valenzuela. To think they somehow hit a homerun in HK is odd to me.

But what do I know?

Yes as I said the CIA didn’t have an success with the umbrella movement, so they try now again using the “extraction bill” to light a fire and pure oil on it.

And yes you are most probably right that CIA was/is involved in destabilizing plots to those countries you listed. But I actually think they think in those cases theirs involvements are going as planned.



I am using sarcasm Trick. We might as well be saying that George Soros is responsible for any protests within the PRC.

RT is complete rubbish and no different from US's FOX news.

I spent time in Hong Kong and I can sympathize with their concerns. In fact I would be out there too and I don't work for the CIA.
Last edited by grzegorz on Thu Aug 08, 2019 6:55 am, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Trick on Fri Aug 09, 2019 3:50 am

According to your view of what is happening in HK Mr.Soros “open society foundation” could very well be a sponsor. For sure a lot of Chinese are impressed by George Soros in the sense that he’s a rich guy, but that’s it.
There’s no sponsors at work here, it’s instigators working behind the scene....


Yes I’m sure you would have be joining on the streets of HK...even that you’re American, or because of that ?
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Trick on Fri Aug 09, 2019 6:47 am

Interesting how many of you guys think this extradition bill is super evil while ok with that HK has an extradition treaty with the US....

Didn’t Edward Snowden manage first to flee to HK but found out the US agencies where still on his back.
Did he think since HK is China he would be out of reach but just in time found out that the USA has for a long time been and still are able to extract from HK those who are thought of as threats to the nation.


And what about Julian Assange, what has happened to him, is he on US soil yet ?
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby windwalker on Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:39 am

. Interesting how many of you guys think this extradition bill is super evil while ok with that HK has an extradition treaty with the US....


What guys ?

You don't see a difference between agreements by countries and agencies within the same government.

The agreement was for 50 years with 22 remaining.
A transition time. if the central government really wanted to take it over directly all they would have to do is change the Visa process.

The mainlanders would come in and take over directly.

In cursory reading it seems there's a lot of other issues involved not directly related to the mainland.

Realistically HK has no real way to preserve its own autonomy.


As long as HK remains valuable for what it is, it's only bargaining chip, conditions may remain somewhat the same.

If both sides disturbe this which seems to be happening now and things change it will lose its only bargaining chip.

The younger generations may not understand this directly. They're living in a place with very little land no housing and no way to attain it.
Last edited by windwalker on Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:02 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby windwalker on Fri Aug 09, 2019 7:56 am

It is interesting as at one time the Hong Kongnese, could always play both sides against each other.

To the British they could say they were Chinese, to the Chinese they could say they fell under British rule.

I imagine it must be very different now as they start to understand that they are Chinese, there is no other authority they can appeal to.

The central government has allowed them a certain amount of time to transition, with the understanding that they will transition.

How or what this looks like remains to be seen.

The Chinese Proverb of 'Sai Weng Lost His Horse'


An old story about a man who lost his horse and his son who found it.

塞翁失馬焉知非福

It might describe an attitude in looking at the events unfolding now.
Last edited by windwalker on Fri Aug 09, 2019 12:34 pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby Ian on Fri Aug 09, 2019 9:26 pm

Trick wrote:Interesting how many of you guys think this extradition bill is super evil while ok with that HK has an extradition treaty with the US....


Does the US have a 99.9% conviction rate? Does it vanish human rights lawyers? Does it practice organ harvesting? Do people in the US get arrested for exercising their civil liberties?
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Re: Hong Kong Protests

Postby grzegorz on Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:43 pm

Trick wrote:
Yes I’m sure you would have be joining on the streets of HK...even that you’re American, or because of that ?


LOL!

I think Ikea is behind these protests so that there will be riots all over HK and everyone will be desperate and have to buy new cheap furniture! :-*
Last edited by grzegorz on Fri Aug 09, 2019 11:49 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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