Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

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Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby oragami_itto on Tue Dec 29, 2020 8:27 am

Or something like that.

Study links some forms of spiritual training to narcissism and “spiritual superiority”

Anew study has found that some popular forms of spiritual training — such as energy healing, aura reading, and, to a lesser degree, mindfulness and meditation — correlate with both narcissism and “spiritual superiority.”

An implicit feature of spiritual training is that it allows its adherents to distance themselves from their egos, and thereby from things such as the need for social approval or success. By encouraging self-compassion and non-judgmental self-acceptance, spiritual training should presumably make people less concerned with such things.

But as a new paper explains, spiritual training may have the opposite effect. Namely, spiritual training might in fact enhance people’s need to feel “more successful, more respected or more loved,” as the authors Roos Vonk and Anouk Visser write.

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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby Bao on Tue Dec 29, 2020 8:44 am

I liked the article, it says a lot of truth. I’ve met so many smug arrogant dickheads amongst Tai Chi, Qigong and meditation practitioners. Aikido is a close contender as well. People who wants to feel superior search up things like mindfulness.

I had a guy showing up to one of my classes. I felt that he had a certain arrogance when he asked: “Tai Chi is about being mindful, right?” I replied: “No, it’s about being mindless.” I guess he didn’t understand or appreciated my dry humor because he didn’t show up again.
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby Tom on Tue Dec 29, 2020 9:14 am

Bao wrote:. . . . I had a guy showing up to one of my classes. I felt that he had a certain arrogance when he asked: “Tai Chi is about being mindful, right?” I replied: “No, it’s about being mindless.” I guess he didn’t understand or appreciated my dry humor because he didn’t show up again.


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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby GrahamB on Tue Dec 29, 2020 11:35 am

I think Tai Chi can have the same effect :)
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby yeniseri on Tue Dec 29, 2020 5:14 pm

Bao wrote:I liked the article, it says a lot of truth. I’ve met so many smug arrogant dickheads amongst Tai Chi, Qigong and meditation practitioners.
I had a guy showing up to one of my classes. I felt that he had a certain arrogance when he asked: “Tai Chi is about being mindful, right?” I replied: “No, it’s about being mindless.” I guess he didn’t understand or appreciated my dry humor because he didn’t show up again.


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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby everything on Tue Dec 29, 2020 5:43 pm

I mean we're all spiritually superior here, right?

Just like this yoga expert.
amateur practices til gets right pro til can't get wrong
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby wayne hansen on Tue Dec 29, 2020 11:21 pm

No it's pretending to do these things and not following the path that breeds arrogance
Most people I see playing the spiritual guru show their real face the moment they speak
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby oragami_itto on Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:23 am

wayne hansen wrote:No it's pretending to do these things and not following the path that breeds arrogance
Most people I see playing the spiritual guru show their real face the moment they speak


Would you say you think you're better than them?
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby wayne hansen on Wed Dec 30, 2020 4:34 pm

I knew that one was coming
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby klonk on Wed Dec 30, 2020 7:59 pm

What you say about humility is one thing. What do you do about it is another. Human Condition 101.
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby Ian C. Kuzushi on Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:18 pm

Or, it could be the other way around. Certainly, there seem to be people on this board who believe they or their teachers can control others with their chi or whatever else. These same people seem to be drawn to myopic, racist, and self-serving views of the world. So, maybe the chicken comes before the egg in this case?

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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby Peacedog on Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:28 pm

As a practical matter meditative/yogic arts tend to make people more of what they are.

The “ennoblement” aspect of serious practitioners is almost entirely about losing their bad habits over time as it detracts from their practice. It it inherently selfish. It is not based off of empathy towards others.

For example, you stop smoking because it makes your qi take a dump when you do. You don’t hate others as it is too much of an emotional drain to invest that kind of energy in an unproductive emotion. Randomly freaking out stops as well. You treat others well as treating them poorly creates too many problems that require your attention later on. You pay your taxes as it is not worth the trouble of fighting about it.

You realize your emotions are just a transient energetic state and that they are largely meaningless outside using them to drive your practice.

Likewise they can be quite financially successful as it is used to provide the resources necessary to drive their practice. You can’t rent out that Scottish tower for three months to do a 100 day ritual without cold hard cash. But you didn’t earn the money for its own sake, you got it so you could achieve a practice goal.

This process can take years and depending upon what is being practiced can actually compensate for bad habits for quite awhile.

But ultimately you get to choose between the bad habit and your practice. The practice wins in the end.

It is a little understood point.
Last edited by Peacedog on Wed Dec 30, 2020 8:41 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby oragami_itto on Thu Dec 31, 2020 8:17 am

Ian C. Kuzushi wrote:Or, it could be the other way around. Certainly, there seem to be people on this board who believe they or their teachers can control others with their chi or whatever else. These same people seem to be drawn to myopic, racist, and self-serving views of the world. So, maybe the chicken comes before the egg in this case?


I was thinking along the same lines, sure they have found some correlation, but they've done nothing to establish causality.

I submit that most people are arrogant, egotistical, and generally have too high an opinion of their own knowledge, worth, and merit. Any research that measures for these values in comparison to ANY OTHER HUMAN ACTIVITY will find some correlation.

But there is something special about the smugness that one can cultivate with just a few simple spiritual tools and minutes a day of practice.
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby Kelley Graham on Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:08 am

To me this is an aspect of lowered standards and the resulting cult-y charlatan-ism. The only solution is to raise standards and make students work harder from the beginning, and I mean the very first introductory lesson. The arrogant and ignorant twats simply disappear. However, this is a very difficult business plan to execute. :)
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Re: Meditation makes you an arrogant twat

Postby oragami_itto on Thu Dec 31, 2020 9:19 am

Kelley Graham wrote:The arrogant and ignorant twats simply disappear. However, this is a very difficult business plan to execute. :)


There's a lot of money to be had in catering to twats.
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