Trump supporters commit sedition

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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Steve James on Sun Feb 14, 2021 12:44 pm

Naw. McConnell is a typical Republican.

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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Ian C. Kuzushi on Sun Feb 14, 2021 1:11 pm

roger hao wrote:AH HA HA HA

It never gets old watching the elite intelligencia be wrong.
How is that feeling when the wind goes out of the sails?

Is it possibly? .......................Trump 2024?

I will bet they don't get beat next time. Lessons learned.
Many more fails and broken promises will make it an easy job

Hillary said of 2016 - "we should have printed more ballots"


???

Pray tell, what was the elite intelligencia wrong about? And, who are the elite intelligencia according to you?

Trump is the only POTUS in the history of the country to be impeached twice. No serious politico or even causal observer thought Trump would be convicted. This is the first time in history, however, that so many of the president's own party voted to convict in the Senate. Trump at this point will only do harm to the Republican party by running again. I hope he does. He was the least popular president in recorded history with the lowest favorability ratings.

As for promises kept: you must be joking. Where's the wall and who paid for it (FYI, he built 15 miles of new wall and Mexico didn't pay for it)? Why couldn't he repeal and replace the ACA? What happened to his 550 billion dollar infrastructure plan? The Keystone pipeline? The list goes on and on.

We are talking about a POTUS who had both branches of congress when he entered office. He didn't accomplish anything aside from a massive giveaway to the wealthy and wreaking about as much havoc on our own environment as humanly possible.

Trump is such a joke that his own neighbors in Palm Beach don't want him there.
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby roger hao on Sun Feb 14, 2021 1:33 pm

Elite Intelligencia -

I meant here on RSF.
I am sure you know who you are if you are in that group.
But - please - I have mad respect for all you guys.
Skills way beyond mine to research - integrate - communicate.
Never mind the sheer hours you all must spend on all the issues.
It's a brain trust and I have always enjoyed it. Carry on.
Regards the riot - my Jedi-Ninja skills may be 4 on scale of 1-10
but that is enough to keep me out of that horse shit.
Same goes for concerts / clubs/ any public gathering - you will not catch me
being a victim of mass shooting or dying in a club fire.
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Steve James on Sun Feb 14, 2021 2:27 pm

Oh well, I'll take the critique. But, in the meantime:
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Finny on Sun Feb 14, 2021 3:50 pm

Yeah.. but would also require a criminal conviction. Which like the impeachment is highly unlikely.
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Steve James on Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:09 pm

Finny wrote:Yeah.. but would also require a criminal conviction. Which like the impeachment is highly unlikely.


Nope. No criminal court could prohibit anyone from holding a federal office. The only entity that can do that is the Congress --the legislative branch. It's the same reason the impeachment wasn't a criminal trial. The Constitution gives the Congress the right to make its own rules. It's why they had to vote to have or not have witnesses. Using the 14th amendment would be unusual, but the Congress has to vote on it.

Prohibition from holding federal offices is a penalty in addition to being removed from office. Putting him in jail isn't one of them. It can still happen, though. The objection will be that the person must have been removed from office. But, the wording concerning impeachment doesn't specify a conviction.
Anyway, Trump would still be free to run for state office.
Last edited by Steve James on Sun Feb 14, 2021 4:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Ian C. Kuzushi on Sun Feb 14, 2021 6:50 pm

Finny wrote:Yeah.. but would also require a criminal conviction. Which like the impeachment is highly unlikely.


Huh? He was already impeached. Twice.

And, as Steve pointed out, these are political matters, not legal. No criminal conviction would be necessary nor would it be necessary in order to have convicted him in the Senate (you seem to be conflating that latter proceeding and impeachment).
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Steve James on Sun Feb 14, 2021 7:16 pm

Yep, 3 presidents have been "impeached." None have been convicted. Clinton was clearly guilty, but was not removed from office. Still, nothing changes the fact they were impeached. Trump can't be removed from an office he doesn't occupy, but the refusal of the Senate to receive and act on the impeachment is the major reason why he wasn't in office.

Some of the defense arguments were really funny. I liked the one "Well, why can't we impeach Washington? He owned slaves, and slavery is illegal." Yah, the problem is that slavery was legal in Washington's day. Besides, his will set most of his slaves free after his death. Anyway, I have no problem with punishing criminal behavior. Who doesn't?
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Trick on Sun Feb 14, 2021 8:12 pm

GrahamB wrote:This will be an interedting development if it happens

(Reuters) - Dozens of former Republican officials, who view the party as unwilling to stand up to former President Donald Trump and his attempts to undermine U.S. democracy, are in talks to form a center-right breakaway party, four people involved in the discussions told Reuters.


https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa- ... fE-MY90t1k

The other day or was it week I read that it as Trump who had the idea to form his own new party..these news agencies seem can’t make up their minds.....or are they part of the divide and conquer plot, stirring people’s minds?
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Steve James on Sun Feb 14, 2021 9:06 pm

Make up their minds??? You know. Some Republicans can be thinking of starting a new party AND Trump was talking about forming a "Patriot." Party. The media is just reporting. But, you could always look it up.
Trump voters split from the GOP to launch wannabe ‘Patriot Parties’

http://www.ncpolicywatch.com/2021/02/12 ... t-parties/

I'm sure there'll be a lot of 'em, whether he has anything to do with them or not. Then again, I'm sure he'll get a piece of the action. Anyway, many of the patriots who stormed the Capitol will end up in prison.
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Trick on Mon Feb 15, 2021 4:20 am

Steve James wrote:Make up their minds??? You know. Some Republicans can be thinking of starting a new party AND Trump was talking about forming a "Patriot." Party. The media is just reporting. But, you could always look it up.
Trump voters split from the GOP to launch wannabe ‘Patriot Parties’

http://www.ncpolicywatch.com/2021/02/12 ... t-parties/

I'm sure there'll be a lot of 'em, whether he has anything to do with them or not. Then again, I'm sure he'll get a piece of the action. Anyway, many of the patriots who stormed the Capitol will end up in prison.

Maybe the plan is that the right wing split up in a couple of slightly different right wing political views(parties) so to in a way attract more voters(voters from the opposition), then so on Election Day they are still together but as an bigger Block than if they where just one party....this is common on both the left and right in some countries, Sweden for example
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Steve James on Mon Feb 15, 2021 7:32 am

There's no "plan." You're wrong. Trump was the one thing that united the party. Comparing it to European politics, he brought together the far-right (Confederates, KKK, etc), the Christian right (Evangelical and Catholic), economic and social conservatives, isolationists, nationalists, as well as rank and file working class people (many of whom had voted for Obama). The working-class voted for Trump because he promised to make life better for them, and put the US "back" on top. (Aka, fck China).

The Republican party is where those particular groups of people found a home because their views conflicted with views held by people in the Democratic party. Or, specifically, they feared that the Democrats would institute policies that would hurt their group. I.e., they'd lose their guns, pay higher taxes, have a health system with death lists, and force women to have abortions.

However, think about-- almost every single conspiracy theory has become a Republican claim against Democrats. Where, you might ask, are the Democratic conspiracy theories about what Republicans do behind close doors?

Anyway, your premise that more parties will unite into a larger party doesn't make sense. Party R has ten parts that only or mostly agree on one thing. If the ten parts separate, the party doesn't get larger. Example: Mike Pence --the party's number two-- was in hiding from people who his boss had told that he could change the election result on his own-- did not speak with his boss for a week afterward. Think about that: the president and the vp not speaking to each other.

Ah, I was going to ask whether you thought Pence would be voting for Trump again. Then, I thought about McConnell, Graham, Rubio, et al. And, I have to take it back. Yeah, it's possible that suckers and the spineless will go for the okey-dokey again.
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Giles on Mon Feb 15, 2021 9:58 am

@Trick:
Apart from what Steve said, your comparison with Swedish politics doesn't work because the USA - in contrast to Sweden - doesn't have a system based on proportional representation. It has a first-past-the-post system. So the kind of coalition-forming between political parties in order to form a government isn't going to happen, can't happen, in the USA.

You can look this up in 60 seconds, you know...
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby Trick on Mon Feb 15, 2021 11:12 pm

Yes as I said elsewhere here, I don’t know much about the USA....and yes I could look up things elsewhere too, but since here are expertise too so why not hear things from you
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Re: Trump supporters commit sedition

Postby roger hao on Wed Feb 17, 2021 10:04 am

Where, you might ask, are the Democratic conspiracy theories about what Republicans do behind close doors?

Russia Collusion - the grandaddy of all conspiracy theories.
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