the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

Posted: **Sat Apr 15, 2023 11:51 am**

ok I can do some tai chi form... feels somewhat relaxed. one part moves, every part moves. harmonies. blah blah.

cannot dance ... it feels like the complete opposite ... and I feel stiff trying to do it.

1. why is this?
2. how do you fix it?

give me some tips.

Posted: **Sat Apr 15, 2023 8:04 pm**

I would say look at what you did to learn to do the tai chi movements so well and then take the same approach to dance moves

Posted: **Sat Apr 15, 2023 9:27 pm**

everything wrote:ok I can do some tai chi form... feels somewhat relaxed. one part moves, every part moves. harmonies. blah blah.

cannot dance ... it feels like the complete opposite ... and I feel stiff trying to do it.

1. why is this?
2. how do you fix it?

give me some tips.

I feel stiff trying to do it

Posted: **Sat Apr 15, 2023 9:31 pm**

You do the individual pattern of steps, just like taijiquan, with hands and feet repeatedly over x times
As an example, instead of going straight to what is called 'form", you start wih the individual postures. For example lft and right side of brush knee/twist step, wave hands in clouds, etc
then when you have it down add to rest of posture in form completion.
In dance, begin with the basics like step to the left then ste to the right to get the riddim

as a start then do what comes after!

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:40 am**

Wow, I went to Eddie's classes in the 90s. On 2, baby.

Afa tcc v dancing, they're totally different, and so is walking. After my spine operation, I could do some tcc, but I couldn't walk well. I couldn't do a rhythmic "one two, one two" step. Going up or down stair steps was difficult. So, I taped two phone books (if anyone remembers those things) and just practiced stepping up and down. Boring. I started listening to salsa while doing it. Eventually, everything improved.

Apart from the anecdote, the main point is the need for repetitive practice. Eddy would always say he was terrible at first, but that's when he determined to become great.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 6:40 am**

hmm yeah ok thanks, makes sense. so

- practice a lot
- do, not try
- break down a simpler individual move first

some things of articulate only one joint or in a more exaggerated way seem a little weird to me at first, but it seems like that helps quite a lot and looks/feels cooler.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 8:15 am**

Afa tcc v dancing, they're totally different, and so is walking.

Would not agree, once a level of understanding is reached through practice every movement is taiji....
Have had people who did yoga, dance or boxing,,,practice often finding they could not leave their ingrained movements behind or worse
feeling what they did would somehow enhance their ability to learn or do taiji... Especially true, for those who practiced yoga,,,

@everything,

When I work with people they often say they can't stope from using force, when I ask them to and demo what it means...

It's not that they can't stop, its more like they really don't want to for "what ever" reason...

Finding out why, addressing this, often quite hard and long process,,in this way its said outer problems can be addressed more easily, then inner problems...Some teachers understanding this will not accept those they feel have inner issues that they can not address, feeling it can't be corrected...

Taiji is movement, dance also movement, expressions of the inner mind/heart. 心 (xīn), soul, ect...both structured towards intended usage..Wushu practice reflecting and idealization of movement, quite different from the original movements, it was based on....

If you'er not looking for specific style or method of dancing,,, you might just limit your taiji movements to 1 or 2 feet sq, put some music or sound that you like on, allow your inner mind flow with it...
see what happens...

In China, they don't talk about someone "doing" a form...they talk about "playing" ie he plays the form really well..or his form play is good.

The main point is to let yourself go, address what ever is holding you back form doing so...

play with it, finding enjoyment outside of the perception of doing something...

Everybody Was Kung Fu Fighting.

Posted: **Sun Apr 16, 2023 10:20 am**

gotta go to a wedding and would rather learn to dance than sit around bored, so trying to figure out the simpler things everyone does. like the simple line dances or simple just standing mostly in your little "box" but moving some.

so far, simple footwork seems simple enough. just a few steps with a bounce. maybe twist your foot. ok.

arms are weird to me, for simpler moves:
- do the same thing at the same time (like both hands up/down, both elbows out/in, etc.)
- or do the opposite direction (like one arm up, one arm down, like miniature diagonal fly but repeated, etc.)

head is ok i guess. only so many ways it can go.
lots of hip articulation and spine articulation, like a body roll? way too difficult for now.
other difficult or complicated moves? nope.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 7:35 am**

It's understandable. Tai Chi movement is whole body coordination, everything moves together. Most dance demands separation of different body parts and arranging them while moving. Tai Chi has a different body skill compared to most arts of body movement. The coordination is different and doesn't necessarily translate into other types of arranging body movement. In fact, if you only practice tai chi for a long time, it could make some types of body coordination harder. I've BTDT...

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 8:17 am**

Bao wrote:It's understandable. Tai Chi movement is whole body coordination, everything moves together. Most dance demands separation of different body parts and arranging them while moving. Tai Chi has a different body skill compared to most arts of body movement. The coordination is different and doesn't necessarily translate into other types of arranging body movement. In fact, if you only practice tai chi for a long time, it could make some types of body coordination harder. I've BTDT...

Also have found that I can no longer practice some of the things I used to practice as mentioned it is quite different...
found it not to be harder but really impossible,,,with out a lot of re working,,,

Having said this,,,dance as an expression of movement from the inside ,,any movement is ok...
unless one is specifically engaged in a type of dance style

Chungliang Al Huang

some one who did dance and taiji,,, he's written a lot of books from long ago don't really know about his taiji skill set..

Chinese Opera is also a type of dance medium where the movements are very stylized and strict..

"Chinese Opera is a traditional performing art form that synthesizes music, song, dance, pantomime, martial arts, and acrobatics into a unified performance style.
In opera, every sound is treated as music and every movement treated as dance"

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 8:56 am**

agree with Bao, but doing tai chi more than other things is maybe just one of my "excuses" lol. think i have trouble for various reasons such as too embarrassed to try/learn as a kid, lack of practice, not-great ROM of various joints, not-great hand-eye coordination (my footwork is slightly better from playing football/soccer), the neuro-muscular control of one joint does this one thing while the other does this other, seemingly unrelated thing isn't there, and so on.

was listening to or watching some music performance the other day while doing a little tai chi, so I wanted to move on beat and in a more "stylistic" way, in a "less tai chi" way. this is just for solo moves in a "box" or maybe the popular line dances "everyone" seems to know. partner dances where the lead holds a "frame" ... too difficult to contemplate although the holding frame thing also sounds slightly easier at the same time.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 9:05 am**

everything wrote:agree with Bao, but doing tai chi more than other things is maybe just one of my "excuses" lol. think i have trouble for various reasons such as too embarrassed to try/learn as a kid, lack of practice, not-great ROM of various joints, not-great hand-eye coordination (my footwork is slightly better from playing football/soccer), the neuro-muscular control of one joint does this one thing while the other does this other, seemingly unrelated thing isn't there, and so on.

was listening to or watching some music performance the other day while doing a little tai chi, so I wanted to move on beat and in a more "stylistic" way, in a "less tai chi" way. this is just for solo moves in a "box" or maybe the popular line dances "everyone" seems to know. partner dances where the lead holds a "frame" ... too difficult to contemplate although the holding frame thing also sounds slightly easier at the same time.

you could try this.

Posted: **Mon Apr 17, 2023 9:15 am**

well that definitely looks like fun

the rum soaked fist: internal martial arts forum

can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why

Re: can do tai chi form...cannot dance...why