Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Buddy on Sat May 24, 2008 4:36 pm

I have to admit, this issue troubles me. While I am an unrepentant capitalist and Constitutionalist, there seems to be a huge disparity here. I don't care about CEO salaries a whit and I wonder if some of the blame doesn't go to speculators, but regardless of the percentage of profits, the profits are astronomical. Whatever happened to noblesse oblige? I have NO answer here, merely thinking out loud.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Mike Strong on Sat May 24, 2008 4:42 pm

It's simple Buddy:

1. Drill for oil off-shore, and in the Upper Mid-West, and ALASKA.

2. Build more oil refineries and nucular power plants.

3. Alternative fuel development.

&

4. Wait for the baby boomers to die.

Problem solved.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Buddy on Sat May 24, 2008 4:47 pm

I can't find much argument here, Mike, even though I'm a pretty strong environmentalist. In that I am included in number 4, I'm sure you'll understand my objection, although understanding its inevitability.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Mike Strong on Sat May 24, 2008 4:57 pm

Hey, I was born in 1960 at the tail-end of the baby boom, ...

... it's the "pig-in-the-python" that needs to set itself adrift on an iceberg and die like good eskimoes.

Besides, - our bodies, our thoughts, our emotions, our politics all melt away into the nothingness that they are, ...

.. but that doesn't mean we cease to exist. ;)
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Buddy on Sat May 24, 2008 5:13 pm

Om shanti. ;D
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby MikeC on Sun May 25, 2008 7:10 am

Mike Strong wrote:It's simple Buddy:

1. Drill for oil off-shore, and in the Upper Mid-West, and ALASKA.

2. Build more oil refineries and nucular power plants.
.


I tend to agree here. I mean, if we think we're smart enough to develop new energy methods, we should be smart enough to develop ways of drilling on our own soil with minimal impact to our environment.

And to those that are against nuclear power, I think they've never had the opportunity to look down inside a reactor with the top off. Friggin glowin electric blue down there, cool
8-)

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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby nianfong on Sun May 25, 2008 9:25 am

klonk wrote:It is not clear to me why anyone would want to hold money out of the economy. It is not even clear that it is possible to do so. Let us say (hypothetically) that I have a million extra dollars. If I buy stocks or bonds, I am participating in the economy. If I buy bank CD's or Treasury notes, I am participating in the economy. If I buy frivolous luxuries like Perazzi shotguns or Ducati motorbikes, I am paying someone for them. Even if I buy a bunch of gold and lock it in a safe, I paid somebody for the gold.


when you buy stocks and bonds you are giving money to some company or government group in exchange for an expected return (stock), or a promised return (bond). Whereas most government entities nowadays (*cough*fucking neo-cons*cough*) do not know how to balance a budget, most companies DO, and in an apparent recession, they end up sitting on a war chest of cash. just plain cash. in a bank. billions of dollars of it. bankers then invest in more stocks/bonds etc. it just keeps going in a circle of stocks in stocks and stocks, cash, bonds, etc. it doesn't go into consumer purchases which actually do drive the economy.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby nianfong on Sun May 25, 2008 9:31 am

klonk wrote:Hum. Yes. All shall be well,if government supervises closely enough, and will pry, and make sure everyone is doing the right thing. We wouldn't want anyone doing the wrong thing. This is the logic of the collectivist, or communitarian if you prefer.

Failed in Russia. Failed in China. Failing, badly, in a reorganized Europe. Do not want.


has not yet failed in the US. electricity, natural gas, water are all government regulated. why not oil too?
oil in taiwan is completely government controlled by the "national gas monopoly". as is booze there. I don't see how their control of it is causing the government to fail (corruption is doing that on its own).
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby somatai on Sun May 25, 2008 9:48 am

drilling for more oil is such a silly and short sighted idea...please it is about real change not poisiniong more of the earth and hastening the already insane environmental degridation that is taking place
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Chanchu on Sun May 25, 2008 11:15 am

Well the economy must still be pretty good- if people can afford to pay near five bucks a gallon for gas and drive huge fat ass SUV's. Damn! a hundred bucks to fill up one of those things....

Problem with drilling is- that if we get more oil it will just delay weaning people off of oil dependance and waste, delay the ineveitable.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby klonk on Sun May 25, 2008 7:36 pm

nianfong wrote:
klonk wrote:It is not clear to me why anyone would want to hold money out of the economy. It is not even clear that it is possible to do so. Let us say (hypothetically) that I have a million extra dollars. If I buy stocks or bonds, I am participating in the economy. If I buy bank CD's or Treasury notes, I am participating in the economy. If I buy frivolous luxuries like Perazzi shotguns or Ducati motorbikes, I am paying someone for them. Even if I buy a bunch of gold and lock it in a safe, I paid somebody for the gold.


when you buy stocks and bonds you are giving money to some company or government group in exchange for an expected return (stock), or a promised return (bond). Whereas most government entities nowadays (*cough*fucking neo-cons*cough*) do not know how to balance a budget, most companies DO, and in an apparent recession, they end up sitting on a war chest of cash. just plain cash. in a bank. billions of dollars of it. bankers then invest in more stocks/bonds etc. it just keeps going in a circle of stocks in stocks and stocks, cash, bonds, etc. it doesn't go into consumer purchases which actually do drive the economy.


If this worries you, you should pay for your purchases with a credit card.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby klonk on Sun May 25, 2008 7:39 pm

nianfong wrote:
klonk wrote:Hum. Yes. All shall be well,if government supervises closely enough, and will pry, and make sure everyone is doing the right thing. We wouldn't want anyone doing the wrong thing. This is the logic of the collectivist, or communitarian if you prefer.

Failed in Russia. Failed in China. Failing, badly, in a reorganized Europe. Do not want.


has not yet failed in the US. electricity, natural gas, water are all government regulated. why not oil too?
oil in taiwan is completely government controlled by the "national gas monopoly". as is booze there. I don't see how their control of it is causing the government to fail (corruption is doing that on its own).


Deregulating utilities has worked rather well in some parts of the U.S. Anyhow the argument that we ought to put government in control of anything new rather troubles me. They aren't doing a good job with the responsibilities they have.
I define internal martial art as unusual muscle recruitment and leave it at that. If my definition is incomplete, at least it is correct so far as it goes.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Darth Rock&Roll on Mon May 26, 2008 5:38 am

it's not about government control, it's about regulation and standardization.

the ones in control are the owners/shareholders and ultimately the consumers.

Consumer advocacy is a dying art and consumer boycotts and actions are all but unheard of these days.
proabbly ahs something to do with the media not really doing much but advertising these days.
I haven't seen an actual journalist in more than 5 years now. Just a bunch of narrative creating talking heads.

rfk has something interesting to say about it on yt. :-)
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby MikeC on Mon May 26, 2008 5:39 am

klonk wrote:Deregulating utilities has worked rather well in some parts of the U.S. Anyhow the argument that we ought to put government in control of anything new rather troubles me. They aren't doing a good job with the responsibilities they have.


Too true. And lower taxes is a good thing too. The less of my money the gov has the less damage they can do.
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Re: Sen. Maxine Waters threatens to Nationalize

Postby Chanchu on Mon May 26, 2008 10:32 am

http://www.smartusa.com/

Smart car how many americans can fit in one?

http://apnews.myway.com/article/20080524/D90S5MLG0.html

Turn off your TV and get ready for the oil crash..... New survivial
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