what makes your art internal?

The following typical threads that plague martial arts sites will get moved here if not just deleted: 1 - My style is better than Your style" - 2 - "Internal & External" - 3 - Personal attacks - 4 - Threads that start well, but degenerate into a spiral of nonsense.

Re: what makes your art internal?

Postby bigphatwong on Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:41 pm

The main criteria I use to determine if a system is internal is whether or not it has its own Chi Gung set. Any art that places primary emphasis training the mind to lead the energy and create a shape, and follows all of the funadamental breath and body requirements can be called internal. To me, internal = operates from the inside out.
That, IMO, is the essence of Hsing-i: using the mind to will the body into spontaneous action.
Last edited by bigphatwong on Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:44 pm, edited 3 times in total.
NOBODY gets near Yung when Tanaka's around. That's for shit sure.
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Re: what makes your art internal?

Postby bigphatwong on Tue Jul 22, 2008 7:46 pm

Oh, and what ed said. ;)
NOBODY gets near Yung when Tanaka's around. That's for shit sure.
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Re: what makes your art internal?

Postby gasmaster on Tue Jul 22, 2008 9:44 pm

The 2 yin bagua guys though on the other hand who had done the whole cultivation route have not only the immense mechanical power of using the spine with the waist but can also, without thought, hit you with the shen. It's what is called and 'even the ghost and the divine (hun and po) will be scared'.


Was this extra oomph a result of the channels being opened, which allowed instantanious freedom, or is there some other explanation that suffers from the must be felt, hard to describe thing?
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Re: what makes your art internal?

Postby D_Glenn on Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:02 am

gasmaster wrote:
Was this extra oomph a result of the channels being opened, which allowed instantanious freedom, or is there some other explanation that suffers from the must be felt, hard to describe thing?



"result of the channels being opened, which allowed instantanious freedom"

Nothing at all like that. It's not hard to describe it's just not believable.



And ever heard the saying "you get more with candy than with vinegar" :)

.
Last edited by D_Glenn on Wed Jul 23, 2008 6:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: what makes your art internal?

Postby cdobe on Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:59 am

From Zhuang Zi, The Floods of Autumn (7):
天在內,人在外
Translated as: "What is heavenly is internal; what is human is external"
Last edited by cdobe on Wed Jul 23, 2008 7:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: what makes your art internal?

Postby Darthwing Teorist on Wed Jul 23, 2008 8:56 am

gasmaster wrote:
to cause the opponent to mirror your breathing pattern and then exploit it

That's interesting, care to elaborate on it.



I'll explain it as well as I understand it. I cannot really do it, maybe with total n00bs, but I am not a level where I can use this effectively, yet.

A good explanation for this, IMO, are mirroring neurons. We pick up signals all the times, consciously but especially unconsciously. So, if your opponent is not aware of his breathing, he will notice, unconsciously your breathing pattern. The mirroring neurons, who are fired in response to another human being's behaviour in order to simulate it in the brain, are probably responsible for him using the same pattern. At least that's my theory.

Now, for applications, I have seen my teacher demonstrate this both for grappling and for striking. For grappling, you can use it to bring your opponent's breathing down, to relax him so you can take advantage of his lack of strength. One way to train it, is to lay on top of your partner, stomach against stomach. Feel the breath, adjust your breath to your partner's then start to slow it. If he is not aware of this breath, he will slow down (or speed up, if you want to do the opposite).

For striking, it is quite simple from what I saw. As you punch someone, you inhale or you exhale or you hold your breath. Your opponent will likely do the same, enabling you to give different kinds of pain and affect differently your opponent, depending on your scope.

There is a similar technique used for de-escalation: as you talk to your opponent, match his speech. Then, after you made a connection to him, slowly start bringing his speech pattern down, calming him. I did not see this in over a year, so the details are a bit fuzzy. You can try it with people around you, I did but I could not concentrate on the tempo long enough to do it.


PS:

I think that this can be explained by NLP. My teacher studied it although I think that the above is a concept found in Systema.
Last edited by Darthwing Teorist on Wed Jul 23, 2008 10:08 am, edited 1 time in total.
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