Crazy (and not-so-crazy) shit about Covid-19

[Bao]

Herd immunity is not something that one accepts or not.
Herd immunity, a term for something that will happen naturally or though intervention that speeds up the process.

Yes of course. But I don't need to accept how politicians use it.

Giesecke, a member of WHO’s Strategic and Technical Advisory Group for Infectious Hazards, is still advising a similar approach to governments elsewhere.

Giesecke was hired only to be on television. He is a notorious lier and an extremely bad guesser who has been wrong every time he has made any kind of prediction. That people in other countries even listen to him is sort of mind-boggling.

... "IMHO" ...

[windwalker]

Those who believe in herd immunity should go out and get exposed. Ask to volunteer at a hospital. That's one way to become immune like 45.

Many have been exposed are asymptomatic
they are wondering why should not work to feed their families while with others
there's not much concern.





Nothing from preventing those worried from taking measures to protect themselves.




People see those advocating polices they don’t follow, do not affect them
or maybe in some cases don't understand

[Steve James]

Sure, "herd immunity" will happen for covid. Just like it has for the flu. Though flu kills people every year, even with a vaccine. There's no herd immunity for ebola --though one of the drugs they gave 45 was developed to fight ebola.

The idea of herd immunity in medicine is to preventative; the idea in politics is Darwinian based on profit.

[Steve James]

Pelosi? What about the president? Poor Herman Cain.

Besides, the resident is encouraging us to turn out at the polls on Nov. 3. He's immune, but sending in his absentee ballot as usual. If we turn out, it'll be the biggest mass exposure since the primaries. I'm definitely going to the polls and stand on line. I'll wear a mask and treat it like going to Target. Fortunately, I don't live in one of those states where they're closing down polling places, thus encouraging crowding.

[Trick]

Without a vaccine, the whole population may or will be exposed. If the pathogen is lethal, it will kill off much of the herd. However, a la Darwin, some of the herd will survive because they're naturally immune. They will mate and have offspring that are also "immune" to that pathogen. Nature selected them. Well, otoh, nature selected the pathogen too. After all, they're just trying to reproduce.

So some/most of the herds had prevention developed herd immunity, perhaps out of similar virus threats throu the past ? Maybe humans were created super immune from beginning but some/most lost it partly/mostly on the way due to various reasons ?
Maybe due to our strong brain capacity for inventing and developing stuff our all over physical capacities decrease ?
But then they say humans with an significant amount of Neanderthal dna are at high risk getting real sick being virus infected?

[Trick]

. Those who believe in herd immunity should go out and get exposed.

but everyone believe in herd immunity, vaccination pushers as antivaxers. Many antivaxers are probably already out moving around, while others wait to be exposed to the needle...

[Steve James]

herd immunity

"the resistance to the spread of a contagious disease within a population that results if a sufficiently high proportion of individuals are immune to the disease, especially through vaccination.
"the level of vaccination needed to achieve herd immunity varies by disease but ranges from 83 to 94 percent"

How many humans are immune to covid? When there are enough immune people, the virus will spread more slowly among the members of the herd who are not immune. That's "herd immunity." Iow, it's not a solution; it's a way to slow the virus's spread.

With no vaccine, there is only one possible way to achieve herd immunity – mass infection. While many could recover from the disease, allowing the virus to spread freely will come at the cost of many, many lives and even more unintended consequences.

It's simple. The more people who are immune, the less chance for them to spread it to someone who's not immune.

[roger hao]

There is a strong consensus that the virus has mutated to a less - lethal strain.

2 things possible -

1/ Theraputics and treatment protocol have improved to stop killing everyone

2/ Virus has mutated to less lethal strain

Both look like a blow to the 'get insanely rich off of vaccine' crowd.

[everything]

I want to get rich off the reopening stocks, but guess I'll stay poor for quite a bit longer.

[everything]

at least with the business news, we can anchor to standard rational self-interest motivation.

with the sheer stupidity in interviews with anti-mask proponents, I just can barely watch the idiocy.

interviewer: why not just wear a mask
interviewee: it's more unhealthy. you inhale CO2. you faint.
interviewer: like all these people wearing a mask, we're seeing them faint?
interviewee: wellllllll

the guy seemed so reasonable until presented with a counter question, then at that point I just couldn't continue. there just isn't any sound reasoning, and there isn't any clear motivational basis here around money-making or public health. just dumb conclusions from no fucking data and no fucking knowledge. i just don't get it.

[Steve James]

There is a strong consensus that the virus has mutated to a less - lethal strain.

So says you. I don't think everyone agrees on that, or anything. However, what you say might just be true.

1/ Theraputics and treatment protocol have improved to stop killing everyone

The part of "killing everyone" is a straw man. No one ever said it killed everyone or even more than 1%. Even the president said/knew that it was more lethal than the seasonal flu.

The problem is that it puts 5x the number of people in the hospital or unable to work. It's true that fewer people in Europe are dying after catching covid. Yep, treatments have improved. But more people are being diagnosed and hospitalized. Not to mention, there's a "consensus" that the virus has chronic effects on some patients, even though it may have little or no effect on most people.

If people aren't concerned with the small number of people who'll die, maybe they'll feel compassion for the larger number of people who'll definitely get ill. And, afa mutations, we're lucky that this variant might be less lethal. Otoh, this is the way the virus survives. If we could give everyone a safe variant of the virus, everybody would be happy.

[roger hao]

Steve - C'mon Man

Maybe you thought I meant that the virus was killing everyone.
I am saying that treatment s were killing everyone.
You are living right there with Gov Cuomo who we all
realize put a bunch of people in nursing homes that were infected.
Instead of like in FLA prioritizing protecting the most vulnerable
he protected the least vulnerable and sent the infected to be with the
absolute most vulnerable.
Next up is the failure of hospitals to provide the right drugs and
treatment protocols. Wait and see - then intubate is now known to not
be the ideal treatment but it was. It was July when did they started
getting IPAC straight.

[Steve James]

I am saying that treatment s were killing everyone.

Don't be silly. Never was "everyone" dying at all, and people are still dying --as you pointed out, even with better treatments.

Cuomo isn't the problem in Texas or Florida which have more cases than NY now, or in Europe. Anyway, what treatment did the president get? Was it the hcq he recommended? Do ya think he would've said so if he did?

It's great that people are dying at a lesser rate than they did a few months ago. But, 500 per day aopt 1000 or 2000 is no comfort at all to anyone who's lost one person close to him.

[Ian C. Kuzushi]

At this point is must be clear that covidiots are not just like religous zelots, they are one in the same when it comes to their worldview.

We have people constantly invoking terms they don't understand. Others who use their intuition as an argument against the theory of evolution. Still others who have claimed that viruses don't even exist. Still more, there are those who argue that the study of history and philosophy should not be part of the cirriculum at university.

These are the same people who are responsible for the extent of the pandemic. These are the same people who make the world a far worse place. These are the people who prove that we need more history, more philosophy, more education. Yes, I know not everyone needs to or is fit to go to university. But, for those very people who are too daft to make it or be inclined to then act as if they are educated or understand how to vet and interpret information is very sad.

Martial mystics, conservatives, covidiots: one in the same and a wart on the ass of all society.

[roger hao]

Steve -
I thought it was clear that I was trying to discuss the fact that
there is a change in lethality of the virus.
You seem to be disagreeing by citing an increase in infections.
And by 'everyone ' I meant everyone who has died.
Am I wrong about the lethality?