Ian wrote:no I don't think you were being arrogant, and even if I did, I don't have time to be angry on the net
there is no example of internal power that can be shown adequately on video, it can only be felt
if internal power can only really be felt and not seen, how can you tell just by looking that the above two gents have no internal power? and if you can tell, then it must follow that you can tell for other clips as well.
<snip>
interloper, upyu, dan, wvmark?
dr. fish, ashe, the uk guys etc.?
I think I just suck at starting topics
Woo...what a can of worms
I'll take a stab at it though.
First you'd need to clarify what you mean by "Internal" power/strength etc.
1) There's a distinct usage and development of the middle/dantien area as a control point that's immediately obvious in the Chen Style, Sam Chin, Li tai liang, etc etc.
2) Then there's the usage of opening/closing of the major joints,
3) Usage of the chest dantien area in some styles (some may favor this as a control over the usage of the middle dantien)
4) Then there's six directional stretching, allowing one to constantly maintain equilibrium (the stretch obtained by pushing the top of the head while letting the spine hang is one contradiction)
5) Breath training which is used to develop 1) and 2) which lead to 6)
6) All of the above lead to a certain kind of "elastic" connection in the body, (this is probably conditioned fascia, but that's anyone's guess). This conditioning support the absorbing of forces, along with generation of power using elements from the 5 points mentioned above.
It's also what allows the 90+ year old bagua dude seen on youtube to do the tricks that he does. This conditioning results in two kinds of elastic "windings" that run through the body. It's also why, as someone mentioned in another thread, you see Karate guys do Sanchin the way they do.
7) Specific usage of the body that allows you to absorb an incoming force down to the ground, and use the reflected normal force to be expressed through the upper body. (Whether you use the actual middle or chest middle is irrelevant for the purposes of this talk)
The 7 points mentioned above are really generalities, and there's more that could probably be mentioned, but I think it's a fair start.
So taking those 7 points, can they be seen?
Yes, especially if you have a bit of the skill yourself and you know what to look for. The conditioning/elastic quality jumps out immediately. What part the person uses as a "control" is also obvious. So it's also obvious if something is "not there."
Getting back to Systema though.
Vlad probably has a nice "up down" contradiction, coupled with usage of the chest middle, which he opens and closes. This in itself gets pretty friggin powerful if you condition it enough. Having done systema myself for a year, enough to get aquainted on a cursory degree, the breathing coupled with the pushups/squats in slo-mo probably lead to tissue/fascia development which help to transmit power efficiently (and probably what give them that magnetic pull and allow for the various psychological tricks). If it is there, then it probably adds an extra oomph to the punches. Usage of the chest middle as a fulcrum allows them to be mobile...
What probably sets them apart from Asian IMAs,
They don't use 7) (more commonly known as Jin skills), nor do they develop the middle area to the degree that you see in Asian MAs. The development of the middle, by the way, opens up a host of movements/skills that are simply unavailable otherwise.
Does it make them "inferior?"
No, not at all. But I certainly wouldn't confuse them as having the same things as Asian MAs.
What it boils down to is that the while there are overlapping elements (which is kind of a no-brainer, they're people, we're people, its inevitable that overlap would happen) the conditioning/usage are, for the most part different.)
And yes, internal power/skill can be seen (according to the seven points listed above) and its painfully obvious when certain points are lacking.