Wudang Taijiquan?

[Syd]

What do you guys make of the whole Wudang Taijiquan thing? I am not quite sure what to think ... some say it is a recent invention while others claim to be 32nd generation lineage holders to something carrying this name. To my knowledge the earliest recorded usage of Taijiquan was when Yang Luchan's art was dubbed so by the court poet Ong Tong He ... so Taijiquan is a posthumous appellation at best that now acts as a catch all for various internal sub styles et al.

The inference seems to be that Wudang Taijiquan is something that has existed in isolation of and predates Yang, Chen, Zhaobao etc. My take is rather that there have been various types of Internal Boxing schools over the hundreds of years but rather than being a precise School or System based art these were more likely Teacher to Pupil systems of the Internal school that may have had Taoist or Wudang themes, origins and/or flavours - for instance Kan Feng Chi was said to be the creator of a style of Internal Boxing etc which was a blend of both internal and external arts. Can we say that Wudang had it's own specific Taijiquan as a formalized system?

So set me straight ... what is this stuff people are claiming to be Wudang Taijiquan these days? Is it legit or is it just bandwagoneering?

[salcanzonieri]

Some sets they do are obviously just reworking of Yang TJQ, other sets they do are not related and are some kind of Nei Jia Quan, Rou Quan material.

[mixjourneyman]

They also have Zhao Bao taiji at wudang, which they call wudang taiji
Interesting.

[Syd]

So could we say that they have blended various Neijia techniques extant with modern Taijiquan to create their own Wudang Taijiquan, therefore it is a blending of old legit systems with Taijiquan and they can kind of get away with calling it Wudang Taijiquan and saying it is ancient due to blending it with old Wudang type Neijia?

[Andy_S]

I was told (my source on this is NOT impeccable, so be warned) that:

The Zhaobao Taiji people have been claiming that their art predates Chen Taiji, and originates from someone connected with Mt Wudang (Jiang Fa? Zhang San-feng?). The local govt (Wenxian) takes this so seriously, that they have banned the practice of Zhaobao Taiji, for fear that the investments they are making in promoting Chenjiagou as the birthplace of Taiji will come up empty if Wudang is able to claim the title.

So there!

[Little Bai]

Douglas Wile's article in the JAMA sheds some light on this. He quotes texts written by both Wudang martial artists as well as Zhaobao guys trying to prove that their Taijiquan styles are the real and old ones. It's safe to assume that both versions are pretty much bogus. The Zhaobao people claim that their Taijiquan was handed down in straight line from Lao-zi to today's practioners, ignoring the fact that even though Taijiquan was always the greatest and deadliest martial art (according to them), Qi Jiguang was not aware of the style when he collected information, nor that the name Taijiquan could not have been used because of the prohibition of using the characters in an emperor's name (Huang Taiji of the Qing Dynasty). Some people also use "ancient manuals" written in simplified characters to prove their version...

[wiesiek]

I don`t now much about W.TJ
but
each master of internal arts is master of his own internal style based on fundamentals /names are not important/
so
Wu dang TJ, Chen TJ, Yang etc are frames.
You have to paint picture for yourself.

We /mankind/ like to look under painting /there are just strechers and canvas/
insted wondering the ART.

my present time of understanding of internal subject.

[TaoBoxer]

I think another aspect of this is that the Concept refered to as "Tai Ji" is a corner stone or Taoist thought and Taoists who have been at Wudang since 1400 or so I'm sure would have attached that name to a set of meovements regardless of whether the Yang or Chen family had ever existed. I have no doubt that the Chen family didn't learn their art from Wudang, but.... did the NAME Taiji Quan originate from the Taoist or from WudangShan? I don't know. There is also a set taught at Wudang called "long Fist" but the more common Longfist obviously isn't from Wudang..... It's just what they call one of their long sets.

Lewitt

[Areios]

well origin or not they now have some good stuff and they training it very hard.

[TaoBoxer]

Amen. I have video I took in January. I was walking up the mountain (the road was "too dangerous" for the bus driver, which in China is saying somthing) at about 8am.... and I came around a corner on the road.... and there were 4 or 5 people doing Xingyi in a courtyard and one guy doing ba gua jian. It was below zero and they were just wearing regular cotton hifu. They train full time, 10-12 hours a day. The guys I met get up at 5am, run for 60-90 min on the mountain, do a kicking class for an hour, then have breakfast. Then weapons class, forms class, lunch, afternoon break, then afternoon classes till about 5. God knows what they do at nite. Probably more, I'm sure. They do this 6 days a week.

Lewitt