windwalker wrote:
wow,,,lots of things mentioned here...
Are the below listed figures true.Muslim Enclaves in Britain
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5177/ ... es-britain
"under 2% no problems"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxdoztoBEuc
They say this is censored in the UK 9:48
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sxefcCwgKNU
middleway wrote: I am sick of the British people falling down divided, and having a paddy rather than standing, dusting ourselves of and saying 'Right, lets get this all sorted out then.'
Here's to us, one more toast and then we'll pay the bill
Deep inside both of us can feel the autumn chill
Birds of passage, you and me, we fly instinctively
When the summer's over and the dark clouds hide the sun
Neither you nor I'm to blame when all is said and done
In our lives we have walked some strange and lonely treks
Slightly worn but dignified and not too old for sex
We're still strivin' for the sky, no taste for humble pie
Thanks for all your generous love and thanks for all the fun
Neither you nor I'm to blame when all is said and done
It's so strange when you're down and lyin' on the floor
How you rise, shake your head, get up and ask for more
Clear-headed and open-eyed with nothin' left untried
Standin' calmly at the crossroads, no desire to run
There's no hurry any more when all is said and done
Standin' calmly at the crossroads, no desire to run
There's no hurry any more when all is said and done
middleway wrote:Now for the rant ...
I am sick and tired of being called a racist, bigoted, intolerant person for the past 24 hours because i voted to leave.
I am sick of people assuming my leave vote was for immigration reasons ... When in fact it was for Economic reasons.
I am sick of hearing how 'Britain' is somehow in the wrong for offering the people the chance to decide on their future.
I am sick of the news networks not reporting the actual news, instead fueling the devision in this country that has grown.
I am sick of the, apparently more educated 'IN' voters, fracturing our country more and more with scare mongery and wallowing in sorrow constantly on facebook.
I am sick of hearing all about how Germany is furious. Since when exactly is the will of the British public and democracy something for foreign nations to become angry over? Germany ... i couldnt care less how angry you are.
Mathew, and if this makes the Germany people you know feel like they cant come to the UK then i ask why you don't feel that way about the USA, Canada, Australia, Japan ... the list goes on and on.
I am sick of not seeing any thought about moving forward now the decision has been made, instead people are just posting more and more vitriol from the news networks.
Finally ... I am sick of the British people falling down divided, and having a paddy rather than standing, dusting ourselves of and saying 'Right, lets get this all sorted out then.'
Where did the strong Britain go overnight huh? A strong Britain with a rich multicultural heritage even before there was an EU? That is the Britain i would like to see rise from this vote but that will only happen if we all stop wining and moaning ... and get acting.
end rant ...
What follows is my attempt at some reconciliation. (it’s long)
Somewhere out there, right now as you read this very post, sits the median British voter.
The median voter is someone like you. Not exactly like you of course, but similar in many ways. More similar than they are different.
They voted Conservative last year and in 2010 because they felt the economy was safer than with Miliband or Brown and Cameron seemed like he’d be a good PM. But before that they voted Labour because times were good, Labour were trendy, they liked Blair and the Conservative party was a bit too… Tory.
If Labour can find a decent leader and make decent policies while the Conservatives don’t, they’ll vote Labour in 2020 (or before...)
Last week this person voted to Leave the EU. Not because they are racist. Not because they are closed minded or xenophobic. Not because they are too thick to understand the issues. Not because they glanced at the front page of the Sun and were triggered to vote as instructed. Not because they are going to die in a few years anyway so they fancied screwing up the futures of their children and grandchildren.
They voted to Leave for two main reasons, one of which I think they were right about and one which I think they were wrong about. They aren’t always right. But neither am I; and neither are you.
Sovereignty. They like the idea that they can vote for a party, with a leader who will be PM and have absolute power and absolute responsibility for the term of the Parliament. If the government does a bad job, they’re out and their policy mistakes (real or perceived) can be completely reversed. They know that’s how it works, and they still know even after hearing and understanding weak “yeah but the EU Parliament is elected and the House of Lords isn’t!” type arguments. They like this system. They feel it works. The idea that in the EU we trade away control over domestic policy for influence over other countries did not seem like a good trade.
Immigration. They like immigrants. They feel sympathy for refugees. They think that it’s a good thing that people want to come and live and work and make a life in the UK. They empathise with the desire to make a better life for oneself and ones family. They have heard that immigration is net positive for the economy, but they aren’t convinced it’s true. They are worried about the impact on public services of rapid immigration. They worry about their access to housing, education, healthcare and transport and they think this is because more immigrants equals more demand for these things. But they don’t consider the supply. I bet you never heard anyone say “the immigrants buy all the food in the supermarket.” They know already deep down that government provided/regulated services (unlike Sainsbury’s) are unresponsive to changes in demand, and they blame the demand. They are yet to figure out that the government is worse at providing services than the market.
They might have put more weight on what they heard from the Remain campaign and David Cameron in particular if it wasn’t quite so hysterical. They might have put more weight on the “Leave is lying to you” argument if it wasn’t so obvious that Remain was simultaneously lying.
They knew that the trade arguments were being vastly overstated as they read them on the US designed, Chinese manufactured iPhone in their hand.
The conclusion is this: The median British voter is not a bad person. Their heart is in the right place, they are not stupid or bigoted, they can be reasoned with and persuaded. If you can believe that, you don’t need to be quite so appalled, disgusted, devastated, scared, heartbroken etc.
Hope not hate.
Steve James"]Hey Chris, I think I was very clear that I thought the primary Brexit argument was economic. What is surprised that there are those here who argue that the immigration of Muslims is or was the driving issue. It is true that you may be tarred with the same brush. That's the position many Muslims are in. It won't matter what you say or do.
Afa Muslim neighborhoods, Warsaw was a Jewish neighborhood, and it was a ghetto. In the US, we have these places called Chinatown, Koreatown, Little Italy, and don't forget Harlem. I know there are people who wouldn't dare walk through those places at some point. But now they're "go to" places for tourists.
Anyway, seems like cosmopolitan London voted stay. And Rob will probably go wherever he wants.
Many of them have neighbors who are of a different color, different religion, different culture and they got along with them so being accused of racism is hurtful and untrue.
So? People have to live somewhere. Immigrant communities traditionally congregate in an area at first - it is usually the poorer areas where they are placed. No need for panic just yet though - according to the last census the UK remains about 85% "white British"
"They" always claim things are censored. I just watched that c lip so it isn't. I didn't see an attack, even though they added scary music to the bit when he was talking to local youth
And then we have this from the Gatestone Institute -
"No-go zones can be defined as Muslim-dominated neighborhoods that are de facto off limits to non-Muslims due to a number of factors, including the lawlessness, insecurity or religious intimidation that often pervades these areas."
I'll say again - I've worked and socialised in some the places mentioned. I used to live in one! They are not "no-go" areas. Just because a right-wing American think tank says so, it doesn't make it true
The Gatestone Institute" is a New York-based advocacy organization that is tied to neoconservative and other right-wing networks in the United States and Europe.[1] Chaired by John Bolton, a former Bush administration diplomat and a conservative foreign policy hardliner, Gatestone is a clearinghouse for right-wing commentaries on national security, the Middle East, and Islam, as well as a convener of high-dollar events on security and energy issues. It is an offshoot of the neoconservative Hudson Institute. The institute was founded in 2011 by Nina Rosenwald, an heiress of the Sears Roebuck empire who has been a key philanthropic backer of anti-Muslim groups and individuals in the United States.
In SF we have the same, the difference is that they are not part of a larger movement, nor seek "IME" to change the greater culture that they find themselves in.
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