"Practical use" - there are too many what-ifs, etc.
wayne hansen wrote:Just saw the post asking if Tang Shou Tao still survives
Yes both the Hsu and Huang branches still have people out there but as an organisation it seems to have declined
There is one school in Taipei that is strongly into mma
Tim Cartmell wrote:So here’s the thing: I’m not criticising traditional martial arts at all, I’m criticising the training methodology you’ll commonly see. If you came to practice BJJ and all you did was lay there on the floor passively and worked through submissions cooperatively for 10 years, you couldn’t fight anybody. It’s not like BJJ is magic, no, it’s the training methodology that makes it work. When I did Xingyiquan in Taiwan with Xu Hongji and his son, we did an hour and a half of hard conditioning, hundreds of push ups, hundreds of sit ups, all kinds of conditioning, then we’d stand and do forms, then we’d do techniques and spar in every single class.
Some of the sparring drills probably came from their judo training, because we did a lot of gripping and throwing, but because it was a fight school we practised sparring all the time. We’d light spar without gear, heavy spar with gear on, do padwork and use then use those skills in the ring.
A lot of martial arts might work, but they won’t work if you don’t practice them for real. Even if every single technique has been vetted by some master, you still have to try it for yourself. What I can do under pressure with my body type and my speed, power and level of technical proficiency might not be what you can do. You can’t take those things on faith. When you’re sparring all the time, all bullshit gets weeded out. You’re not going to practice anything that doesn’t work, it’s just a waste of time. How do you know if something’s going to work? Well, you try it in the ring, or when you spar.
You can take any traditional martial art, but you’ve got to spar, but you’ve got to do it correctly. There’s no art that includes practical, useable techniques that’s too deadly to spar with. Is every technique in your art absolutely deadly? The answer is no, so why can’t you take the practical techniques and use them against a resisting opponent?
wayne hansen wrote:Just saw the post asking if Tang Shou Tao still survives
Yes both the Hsu and Huang branches still have people out there but as an organisation it seems to have declined
There is one school in Taipei that is strongly into mma
grzegorz wrote:wayne hansen wrote:Just saw the post asking if Tang Shou Tao still survives
Yes both the Hsu and Huang branches still have people out there but as an organisation it seems to have declined
There is one school in Taipei that is strongly into mma
As one who has trained MMA, BJJ and boxing for years I suppose I shouldn't be surprised but I have to admit that I am disappointed to see traditional schools switch to MMA.
In real fighting I never think in terms of MMA but traditional CMA with or without a knife.
grzegorz wrote:FWIW, MMA also attracts lots of athletes whose interest in arts is only about competition. Point being that I think MMA builds fighters in part because it attracts highly competitive athletic people and those who don't fit into that mold will probably discontinue at some point.
marvin8 wrote:grzegorz wrote:wayne hansen wrote:Just saw the post asking if Tang Shou Tao still survives
Yes both the Hsu and Huang branches still have people out there but as an organisation it seems to have declined
There is one school in Taipei that is strongly into mma
As one who has trained MMA, BJJ and boxing for years I suppose I shouldn't be surprised but I have to admit that I am disappointed to see traditional schools switch to MMA.
In real fighting I never think in terms of MMA but traditional CMA with or without a knife.
You may be misinterpreting them. They did not "switch to MMA." They are doing "Xing yi sparring," as Tim Cartmell explains it. As part of their aliveness training, they spar or may enter MMA competitions. In training for real fighting, they think in terms of aliveness (e.g., energy, movement, timing, etc.). Who's to say "traditional CMA" did not spar or compete (lei tai)?grzegorz wrote:FWIW, MMA also attracts lots of athletes whose interest in arts is only about competition. Point being that I think MMA builds fighters in part because it attracts highly competitive athletic people and those who don't fit into that mold will probably discontinue at some point.
MMA attracts lots of people whose interests are learning to defend themselves against non-compliant opponents which the martial arts were designed for. Most of the time MMA is spent training, not sparring or competing. MMA gyms are often referred to as teams, as they work together to become better martial artists.
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